The reasons synthetic oils are better

[Bob Monkhouse]

I\'ve been reading the various info on different oils in the rotary and it has made me  ponder, as the rotary engine is basically a two stroke with a total loss oil lube system, would it not be possible to use a two stroke specific oil in the sump? It seems to me that the main place the rotary needs lubing is the apex seals/rotor housing. As 2T oils are specifically designed to be burnt and also to lubricate at high temps then they would be ideal for the RX. Also 2T oils are often used as gearbox lubricants and withstand the high pressures between gear teeth extremely well. As for seal compatibility I can\'t see there being a problem there either. Just a thought? I might add that ,though I don\'t possess a PHD etc, I have tuned two strokes for over 30 years, its probably why I love the rotary engine so much,its just a pity the ****ing things are so expensive-1200 quid for a gasket set, someone is taking the ****! Anyone remember the smell of Castrol R? Mmmmmmm, rotary engines on \'R\', yes please!!!( Before anyone says that R is old hat, an oil test a couple of years ago still rated it one of the top engine lubricants). I would like the experts to comment on the above points also,Clive commented on \'Slick 50\', is it usable in the RX? I saw some impressive tests a few years ago and er, I was impressed!!

[kev-yorks]

There\'s a few of us running castor based oils for premix get yourself to the Squires meet tommorow evening and there\'ll be a couple of us there running it if you need a fix.
Kevin

[TINT DESIGN]

what about Comma Motorsport 5w50? any good? I\'m just about to use it...

[ohms]

Well, received my shipment of Silkolene Pro-s oil from OPIE oils this week and set about dumping the mineral oil out of the sump. I\'ve only had the car a week and it\'s always had an oil and filter every 1500 miles albeit with mineral oil. I personally wouldn\'t stick mineral oil in my TD xantia, never mind my pride and joy!
 
Before I filled her up with the pro-s I set about flushing as much of the  crap out of the oil system as possible, so I went to Tescos and bought a load of their 10w-40 mineral oil and carried out 5 oil changes until the oil that was draining out looked as clean as when i first put it in. With this done I changed the filter and poured in the pro-s.
 
Since running the car on the pro-s i have noticed a few things...
 
1. It smells better out of the exhaust and not only that if you get a bit close and take a good whiff, it doesn\'t seem to choke you like it did on mineral oil. Hardly scientific and wouldn\'t recomend anybody else try it, but it suggests to me that it\'s running cleaner.
 
2. The car was hesitant on mineral oil and felt a bit lumpy at times...This trait has been completely banished and the car is much smoother all the way to the rev line, with no jerkiness on part throttle or when under load. Quite amazing!:yes
 
Personally i\'ve never known an oil to make such a difference to the running of a car, it\'s certainly never been noticeable on any pistons engines I\'ve ran before.
 
So to summarise, i would highly recomend making the switch, i definitely feel much more confident to use the power and light the turbos up now that I know they are getting the best protection possible and the car just damn well runs alot better on the stuff!!:3gears-rh

[ohms]

Well, received my shipment of Silkolene Pro-s oil from OPIE oils this week and set about dumping the mineral oil out of the sump. I\'ve only had the car a week and it\'s always had an oil and filter every 1500 miles albeit with mineral oil. I personally wouldn\'t stick mineral oil in my TD xantia, never mind my pride and joy!
 
Before I filled her up with the pro-s I set about flushing as much of the crap out of the oil system as possible, so I went to Tescos and bought a load of their 10w-40 mineral oil and carried out 5 oil changes until the oil that was draining out looked as clean as when i first put it in. With this done I changed the filter and poured in the pro-s.
 
Since running the car on the pro-s i have noticed a few things...
 
1. It smells better out of the exhaust and not only that if you get a bit close and take a good whiff, it doesn\'t seem to choke you like it did on mineral oil. Hardly scientific and wouldn\'t recomend anybody else try it, but it suggests to me that it\'s running cleaner.
 
2. The car was hesitant on mineral oil and felt a bit lumpy at times...This trait has been completely banished and the car is much smoother all the way to the rev line, with no jerkiness on part throttle or when under load. Quite amazing!:yes
 
Personally i\'ve never known an oil to make such a difference to the running of a car, it\'s certainly never been noticeable on any pistons engines I\'ve ran before.
 
So to summarise, i would highly recomend making the switch, i definitely feel much more confident to use the power and light the turbos up now that I know they are getting the best protection possible and the car just damn well runs alot better on the stuff!!:3gears-rh

[Kaptainbalistik]

There\'s a few of us running castor based oils for premix get yourself to the Squires meet tommorow evening and there\'ll be a couple of us there running it if you need a fix.
Kevin

Getting any plug fouling? and does it reduce octane significantly like Engine oil?

I run 2 stroke and Engine oil and the only difference is the Motor oil is smokier!

Also, To wade in to the Synthetic debate, Mobil does not recomend normal Mobil One for the Rotary, It recomends the Motorsport version, Which is the same formulation as the original Mobil One.

I used to be a Mobil one fan till they changed formulation , After being on the wrong end of a Spun bearing that stopped pretty quick! Penrite HPR 40 All the way now!

[MADZASPEED]

newbie here... just checkin out this great site and i was following this post and thought i\'d put in my 2cents... forever what it\'s worth...
 
well doesnt 2 stroke engines use premixes? aren\'t some of them synthetic/ based? don\'t some of you guys run premixes? those with omp\'s and without? then if synthetic is bad, how come it doesn\'t affect your engine when it\'s added in the fuel? questions,questions,questions... i\'ll never say synths r bad oils... to me they\'re GREAT... but if mr. mazda doesn\'t recommend it then surely it should mean something? i\'ve reasearched and looked at this topic for awhile but... i think i\'ll have grandkids and i\'ll never know...

[DR SCHNITZEL]

I use fully synth, 0 - 30 for max flow at startup, and good for turbos.
just wonder if petrol dilution makes this oil too thin?

[DR SCHNITZEL]

Oh yeah i just want to add i read something on the american forum about a man who had in his life stripped down many many rotary engines and found that those using synth oil had much less wear on average than mineral. To me synth is god, for all the initial posters points and more.
 
Id only reccommend mineral to someone who i would want to wear their engine out prematurely for some reason.

[arrouk]

i dont think any one would say synth oils are bad (i myself use a fully synth oil) BUT some of the base chemicals used in the production of these oils can have detrimental effects on differant engine componants such as oil seals, as is explained somewhere in this tread.

matt

[jon haines]

hi, been reading some of the pros and cons on synthetic oil and wanted mazdas opinion, my bro is a mazda tech of twenty years and although not a rotary expert got me a service infomation bullitin dated 10/08/06.reads as follows

if synthetic oil is used on a rotary (rx7 or rx8) engine, there is a possibility that carbon deposits may accumilate, which WILL cause some trouble to the engine. it shows a pic of a rotary with a  large amount of sticky carbon around the inlet port stating the following -
if the carbon deposit is accumilated in the combustion chamber it will get to the plug hole and seal resulting in misfire and knocking.
he also threatened to "tw?t me" if he ever found me using any other than recomended oils,  he said that all warranty failures on rx8 go to japan for stripping and if deemed to have been run on semi or full synthetic oil- NO WARRANTY. he seemed to thinks mineral oil was used because it burns off leaving no residue whereas synthetics resists burn so can accumilate and however good would eventually break down leaving the residue and carbon. i am not looking for arguments only to forward what i was told, i will gladly forward a copy of the bullitin to anyone who wants to post it, jon.

[andrewrx7]

It is a debate that will just go on forever, won\'t it! While I am neither for or against synthetic, I personally would like to see more information regarding Mazda\'s comments, to be able to make an informed decision. I find it really frustrating that they have a statement such as the one above, and simply state "synthetic oil". What grade, what make etc etc did they get these results from?? Synthetic oil is such a blanket term it is almost meaningless. Put it into context, it\'s like saying "only put in mineral oil" and leaving it at that. Does that mean then you can go to B&Q and get the £1 for 10litres cheapest stuff and it would be OK? I\'d hazard a guess that it would not! For me, what would make Mazda\'s comments much more credible, is to say which brands they have tested and the results they have got with them. I appreciate they will never test every oil available on the global market, but it would make their statement(s) much more meaningful to know which oils they tested, when they did the testing and then results they got.

[cyman]

has anyone used mobil synt s oil ??  i can get this cheap but want to make sure its good to use first

[JapHunter]

For your information... In Japan, most of the great garages such as RE-Amemiya or R-Magic recommend and use high quality 100% synthetic oil in 10W40... This is the oil they put in their racing track RX7 and in street/road RX7!!!:wiggle
 
So... they don\'t use it for nothing...

[Macer]

For your information... In Japan, most of the great garages such as RE-Amemiya or R-Magic recommend and use high quality 100% synthetic oil in 10W40... This is the oil they put in their racing track RX7 and in street/road RX7!!!:wiggle
 
So... they don\'t use it for nothing...

I agree!

Also, this is interesting: http://www.mazda.co.jp/service/parts/oil/synthe_renesis.html

A fully synthetic Rotary oil from... Mazda :yes