Ignition on a 13B

[Grant Monkhouse]

As a few people will know I am going to be running a 13B bridge ported turbo engine in my car, with fuel injection.

Now as I\'m Getting closer to where I need to sort the wiring for the stand alone I want to know what to do with my ignition. I have already bought an hks twin power so I can basically take the ignition set up from an FD and run it with my engine.

I am also wanting to run W/I with my setup so need something that can handle this.

The easy answer is to just use the twin power, but I have been told about using LS coils as you don\'t need to have an ignighter and provide a good spark for the WI.

I know I should use the search function but if I don\'t know where to start I don\'t know what I\'m looking for.

[m1tch]

FD coils are really wimpy compared to FC coils lol the twin power box doesn\'t really do much with the spark plug, check out the size of MSD ignition amps vs the twin power

[Grant Monkhouse]

I don\'t want to have to spend a fortune on it. I have seen Rices ignition system, that would cost me well over a grand to build that.

The hks can work well up to 1.5 bar with WI, not that I want to go that far just yet. I will rewire what is necessary for the ignition so there isn\'t a weak link.

[turbotoaster]

rices igntion system wont cost you a grand mate, i priced up everything in the uk delivered for £450, im going down that route as that way ill never have to worry about it again.

what your paying for with rice is a pure plug and play system with everything wired and done.

Id rather save the money and have a go at doing it myself(and id make a rubbish sparky)


if you already have a twinpower i would use that with fc coils, that will do you for 500cc of w/i which should be plenty for a while

[Grant Monkhouse]

I know this but what I\'m wanting to do is build it for the future. As the saying goes too much power still isn\'t enough. Lol.

Once I can handle the car with my current turbo I will be looking to go bigger and run more WI. So I don\'t want to have to fanny around changing it again. Try and do it right once.

[TRIND-FD]

Just use 2 x twin powers, 1 for leading n 1 for trailing. Easy

Keith

[turbotoaster]

then go down the dynatec route then, fit and forget!

[rx7boy]

As a few people will know I am going to be running a 13B bridge ported turbo engine in my car, with fuel injection.

Now as I\'m Getting closer to where I need to sort the wiring for the stand alone I want to know what to do with my ignition. I have already bought an hks twin power so I can basically take the ignition set up from an FD and run it with my engine.

I am also wanting to run W/I with my setup so need something that can handle this.

The easy answer is to just use the twin power, but I have been told about using LS coils as you don\'t need to have an ignighter and provide a good spark for the WI.

I know I should use the search function but if I don\'t know where to start I don\'t know what I\'m looking for.

I am using ls3 truck coils with the built in igniter. The problem you will find is they need large amounts of time to charge (dwell time) This is why I am running them as non wasted spark as your effectively halving the amount of time they get to charge in wasted spark format.

To do this you either have to use the existing trailing wires to control them individually (only one set of plugs work) or use a ecu which has 4 ignition outputs and dual ignition maps.

They put our a fair amount of power especially is set up correctly. However I would recommend finding something plug and play

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mazda-RX7-FD3S-MSD-Ignition-Coil-Accel-Ignition-Amp-/130536849875?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item1e649a41d3#ht_500wt_1156

Martin has this setup from a drag car and is well priced, may require a small amount of modification for an FC but will cope with your WI

Any more questions drop me an email dale[dot]pluthero[at]gmail[dot]com

[rx7boy]

then go down the dynatec route then, fit and forget!

Not so fast, I know of 2 units that have crapped themselves within minutes of being fitted and dyno\'d. They just seemed to work for a few pulls then just show error lights.

[BlitzBoy]

If you use new wiring for the FD Ignition system , new leading and trailing coils you will be good for your power goals. FC coils are not any better, LS coils dont do wasted spark I believe so you would need an ECU which is not the Apexi to use them correctly or wire up the trailing in some way.
I did 450rwhp on a bone stock FD ignition
468rwhp with WI , stock FD with Twin power.

What are you power goals Grant?

In regards using Two Twin powers ?? WHY, the Twin power has output for the Leading and Trailing coils, so no need for two twin powers lol

If your power goals are over 550rwhp and keeping the Apexi ECU go with an MSD setup like what Ross did with his drag car. Or if going aftermarket ECU like a Motec or Microtech they offer themselves different ignition solutions

[Grant Monkhouse]

now this is what i was wanting, not knocking anyone elses suggestion but this ^^^^ is what i wanted to get from this.
 
i will be wiring the ignition so it brand new, with new cable etc as this will also help me to understand what the ignition is actually doing (i am a commercial electrician so i know my way around a pair of snips ans crimpers)
 
Blitz i am aiming for 450HP with the apexi ECU, going for another ecu at the moment just isnt cost effective as they are really expensive!! I have all the components for the apexi, data loggit, wide band etc.
 
once i have the car running quick, maybe a 10 second pass, and i hit a point i cant beat that time i will be going for more power, now seen as a bigger turbo is cheaper than a 3 rotor build (even though i have just been offered a 3 rotor block at a very good price) that is the way i will be going for more power, and i want to make sure the ignition will work when i reach that point. as with a bigger turbo i would surely increase my amount of water injected to gain greater benefits from a biger turbo?
 
i may sound like im stupid with this ignition stuff, and i will admit i am. everyone must start somewhere.

[Mir]

Grant you are not alone in this dilema, I am also sailing in the same boat lollll

Motec do their own ignition set ups, but I would like to hear about those set ups before I embark on them. I know someone in Australia, who is running a 3 rotor in an FD. His 20b has three individual turbos along with EGT\'s on the exhaust ports. He uses that car as a daily driver and he is using MSD set up on Motec...which is beyond me loll

This topic is so perplex and cumbersome that it is unlikely that you would get collective vote on one set up.

Mir

[Grant Monkhouse]

Grant you are not alone in this dilema, I am also sailing in the same boat lollll
 
Motec do their own ignition set ups, but I would like to hear about those set ups before I embark on them. I know someone in Australia, who is running a 3 rotor in an FD. His 20b has three individual turbos along with EGT\'s on the exhaust ports. He uses that car as a daily driver and he is using MSD set up on Motec...which is beyond me loll
 
This topic is so perplex and cumbersome that it is unlikely that you would get collective vote on one set up.
 
Mir

very true,i think what i need to say really is that if a bullet proof ignition system is going to cost in the 1,000s then i will stick with the twin power but make it as good as possible with new wiring etc

[rx7boy]

very true,i think what i need to say really is that if a bullet proof ignition system is going to cost in the 1,000s then i will stick with the twin power but make it as good as possible with new wiring etc

Just so your aware the ls3 truck coils are £45 each

[Grant Monkhouse]

So here are some silly question.

How many coils are there? One per rotor I assume.

How many igniters are there? Someone mentioned these early but i don\'t know what they are, just googled it and now I know what they look like.

What do the igniters do exactly?

What do the coils do?

These are daft questions I know but let someone teach and let me learn!!