got the fd dynod today

[Grant Monkhouse]

That would be a useably fast car that you could drive every day.  Imagine it lightened and caged on a trackday, that would be a serious weapon.  No unpredictable boost spikes, as you get with ronnied twins, no violent surge like a big single, that would be very fast.

Yep, didn\'t Shaun run a setup like this but with a gt35? Would be good to hear his opinion

[Will66]

Shaun\'s got something like this but he\'s got something like 380 whp and a bucketload of torque.  Looks like it drives nicely from following him.

[Grizzly]

I don\'t think you understand where I\'m coming from with using a smaller single turbo. A single simplifies things, a single reduces temperatures, a single can run up to 40psi if you so wish, the twins give heat which means loss of power and more chance of det.

You can\'t tell me that choosing a single turbo that spools up slightly later, at 3500rpms and gives you great power to 7000rpm and drops
Off isn\'t as good as the twins? It would have more hp and less heat. All this on a street car.

I can\'t see spending a fortune on BNRs just to gain 50hp credible, plus there\'s still all that heat!

My mate has had a number of 20B setups and was telling me this weekend about the first one he did. This was a stick port 20B with the 20B exhaust sleeves, with a gt42 turbo none ball bearing, now that\'s a big turbo even for a stock 20B, he had full boost by 3,000 and it held all the way to 8,000rpm, now that\'s a street setup, huge power band. Now take that setup and scale it down to a 13B. It would work, just got to choose the right combination.

My mate now has a 20B PP twin gt4088r setup and that is spooling the turbos on tick over;)

Yep, well when you can get 25mpg come back and we\'ll compair cars

Anyway think you have got it mixed up, STREET!! not talking drag here, Big ports mean No off boost torque... Simple.... I bet you car is really fast but for the Largest Power band Twins win every time and i\'m sure i have Dyno print outs saying that. Yes Twins make the most heat and are overly Complex but then there is NO Single set up now let allone 20 years ago that has the same Responce as a Turbo half its size.

Now i know you are trying to cover the Turbo\'s short comings with Big ports that are needed to spool them up quickly, thats not fair game, you find me 1 Single turbo that Makes 350hp and spools from 2500rpm on a Low overlap motor and has the same EGT\'s.

[Grizzly]

I would bet my rx4, when finished, would beat a twin turbo setup on the street, why? Because I have more HP everywhere and have got a much better diff ratio to make my car better on acceleration rather than top speed, although the gearing does work out to give 180mph at 8500 rpm.

Ok, Yep but you cruise on the Motor way at 3000rpm, still a Road car?

Get on a short twist Track where the Twins MUCH quicker out of corner Turbo responce can help its masive power disadvantage and you might get the idea of what Fast responce is.

[Grizzly]

This is what I\'m talking about, an undersized single turbo working its arse off. Probably never going to over speed it, especially
On stock ports, plus more boost can be used = more torque

LOL You copying me on FDUK (K2EDG)

You get the Picture Smaller turbo for your Goal the better, now imagen one too small for your goal but has a boost mid range so it can achive your goal, yes Boost Spikes as the second Turbo comes in but that can be tweaked so its Much smoother.

I Love Turbo\'s that are Matched to engines and you don\'t get any better matched that the stock twins? it\'s just the Jumps are usaly in 100hp\'s 350 all day the Twins are best, 450 GT35R (can you belive the 35R is still not the best choice for this HP level), 550 (well haven\'t got that far yet but i\'m sure some thing like a Z

[Grant Monkhouse]

LOL You copying my on FDUK (K2EDG)

You get the Picture Smaller turbo for your Goal the better, now imagen one too small for your goal but has a boost mid range so it can achive your goal, yes Boost Spikes as the second Turbo comes in but that can be tweaked so its Much smoother.

I Love Turbo\'s that are Matched to engines and you don\'t get any better matched that the stock twins? it\'s just the Jumps are usaly in 100hp\'s 350 all day the Twins are best, 450 GT35R (can you belive the 35R is still not the best choice for this HP level), 550 (well haven\'t got that far yet but i\'m sure some thing like a Z

Yeah, I did agree with you on fduk. Didn\'t realise it was you:(

My input was for a person wanting more than 350hp and not wasting money on the BNRs. A 35R single would be a lot better simpler and more reliable. I will pm Shaun later and get him to share his setup and previous setup as his is the closest to a street engine setup.

[Grizzly]

I\'m sure this has got mixed up and confused some where along the way, i was trying to say the turbo set up he has now is made for "Street" it has plenty of Torque from 2500, powerfull enough to own so called quick cars / 99.9% of Boy racers while it keeps very fast almost NA Turbo responce with decent MPG/road manners about town. Of course if you did a 4000rpm rolling pull against a 500hp single the Twins will pull away to start with due to the responce then it would be even while the torque/hp picks up to the same level so would be even to say 6k where the Extra Grunt will pull you back.

Thing is with FD\'s 50hp isn\'t allot in the scheme of things at peak, you can really upset people with bigger hp when you start loosing weight out of the car as well as a really good usable power band.

The Reality is where can you use the HP? even if you take a 450hp fd to a track day that sort of HP will kill pads and tyres really quick, the other thing is at that level your going to be making just as much heat as the 350hp twins the diffrence is your more likly to have WI/big IC on a 450hp fd so you don\'t see it so much. So for me 350 is the ideal Street power (you can run a nice quiet exhaust, keep the air con and don\'t have to worry about leaving your diff/gear box at a set of lights

[Grizzly]

Yeah, I did agree with you on fduk. Didn\'t realise it was you:(

I just Like arguing  tbh its more fun on FDUK because there Drag boys chirp up and they see every thing as one number, ither the Peak number you get on a Dyno or the Time you get at the Strip. So 500hp will always beat 450hp!! Right

[Grant Monkhouse]

I just Like arguing  tbh its more fun on FDUK because there Drag boys chirp up and they see every thing as one number, ither the Peak number you get on a Dyno or the Time you get at the Strip. So 500hp will always beat 450hp!! Right

Haha yeah, a lot of people also don\'t realise is changing the gearing. Different gear set or different diff ratio. This can help make a car faster, the 4.7 diff in my rx4 should prevent me from dropping out of my power band, hoping the be on full boost by 4500 and pulling all the way to 8500. I have just ordered a pre turbo only WI kit, should make things interesting.

[Grizzly]

Got to Love Old school be good to see an RX4 picking its feet up

[Grant Monkhouse]

Got to Love Old school be good to see an RX4 picking its feet up

Wheel stands may happen if I get a PP turbo in there and some race fuel!!:D

[zeppelin101]

This is what I\'m talking about, an undersized single turbo working its arse off. Probably never going to over speed it, especially
On stock ports, plus more boost can be used = more torque

Doing some brief calcs, I reckon you could hit 1bar boost by 3000rpm using a GT3076R without breaking a sweat.

Say you aimed for around 350whp - maybe 1.3-1.5bar boost. Given the small hot side on a 3076R you\'re going to end up with some restriction sooner rather than later, but it would be a mid-range torque machine.

I don\'t think a setup on twins would know which way a car setup like that had gone.

You should be able to just about avoid surge issues as well with such a turbo which doesn\'t seem to necessarily be the case with the GT35s.

As a tractable mid-range single setup, I reckon that would be pretty hard to beat.

That\'s only looking at Garrett as well, I haven\'t even considered what might be in BWs lineup or anyone elses, there may be something with a more meaty hotside.

As an aside, your still right in the mid 70s efficiency wise so your heat conversion rate against boost is very respectable.

[Grant Monkhouse]

Iv just had a brain wave!! Borgwarner EFR turbos!!!! Boom response and top end power. Shame they\'re expensive and as rare as hens teeth

[Grizzly]

And round we go again

I atualy Know some one with a GT30R fitted, he is using a T3 .7 Hot side and it picks up more or less like an NA but you can feel the power just die at about 5500 rpm like you have let off the throttle (he runs aprox 310rwhp not sure what boost but i know its Maxed out) but his torque at 4k is the same as Mine its just he has twice my Torque at 3000 but he\'s done that for a reason (he plays at Auto x)

The mad thing is it still spools up low down about the same speed as a set of Stock twins

GT35r\'s are Over rated if you ask me, Good as a plug and play turbo yes but i have a Turbo thats comonly found and 10+ years old, ok its a bit tweaked and has a very good quality 360 bearing in it but it pulls the best Power curve i\'ve come across (450hp at the fly). The best thing is its 100% reliable.

Its not hard to select the Right turbo for the Job you just have to know whats about and not get sucked into the Hype.

[Grizzly]

Iv just had a brain wave!! Borgwarner EFR turbos!!!! Boom response and top end power. Shame they\'re expensive and as rare as hens teeth

Expencive... Yeh rare Urm maybe