13B sumps ?

[MikeLMR]

does anyone have a spotters guid to 13b sumps ? The one on the 13B egi I have is fairly deep in the centre with a big cutout on the drivers side for the engine mounting on that side. But what do other sumps look like and do they bolt up to the 13b out of the EGI ?

The 12a sump I have looks much shallower at the front than the 13B one I have.

[oldone]

Come visit and we build you a sump Mike......:Giggle :cool

[MikeLMR]

I\'ve no problem making one, it\'s just the how much oil do we need and where can it be shallow and where it can\'t is the bit I\'m struggling with

[oldone]

I\'ve no problem making one, it\'s just the how much oil do we need and where can it be shallow and where it can\'t is the bit I\'m struggling with

Just see how shallow a Rx8 sump is and you wil be shocked,obs the 8 will have a good pickup and baffle system,I always believe that the pickup must have a continues reliable supply of oil under hard acceleration and a good baffle plate for the awkard positions we put our cars in.Sometimes its diff to explain without actually seeing what the prob is.........:wiggle

[MikeLMR]

I\'m sure we can come up with somthing between us do you think an rx8 sump and pickup would bolt onto an earlier 13b ? (not going to go out and buy one [thats cheating!] but it is interesting to know) once we get the engine where we want it I\'ll have a much better idea of what needs to move as well.

Had a think tonight while doing some mindless tasks (hacksawing lots of box section, grinding etc.) and remembered that i\'d seen some sumps that had two deep bits with a cutout for the x member whatever and a pair of oil cooler hoses joining the two sumps together.

[oldone]

Will send you some ol school photo\'s of sumps.........wicked.....:guinness

[MikeLMR]

excellent ... some inspiration is whats required.

Hoping to have the engine sat in just about it\'s final place tonight. Got some gaskets on order so I can swap the front covers over and then the engine mountings can be fabricated

[nikp]

I could photo mine while it\'s off if you like mike? 13B REW type.

[MikeLMR]

if you could that\'d be really usefull.

[MikeLMR]

Right I think we have a plan.

Solution to the problem is in two parts.

1. Refabricate the suspension cross member so that the structure linking the chassis rails now sits just infront of the engine

2. Custom sump to clear the Steering drag link. The plan is to remove the sump and trace the pattern onto some 14 gauge steel sheet and drill for the sump bolts and a few clearance holes for the oil pressure reg and pickup pipe

Then fabricate a sump around the steering making sure to keep a similar capacity and to baffle the pickup. We may add some capacity by adding some wings to the side of the sump

the dodgy paint drawing is somthing I had been thinking about and here are some inspiration photos. I\'m hoping that we can get the engine in such a position that I can eliminate one of the two sumps and just have the one and a flat area for clearance for the steering.

[mullins]

1. Refabricate the suspension cross member so that the structure linking the chassis rails now sits just infront of the engine

Aren\'t the suspension arms attached to this cross member Mike or are you using an RX-3 style front cross member? Looking at your pics it looked too far back to be an RX-3 style one?

[MikeLMR]

yep, we aren\'t moving the ends of it but we are redesigning it so that the centre part won\'t be in the way of the engine. I\'m not sure quite how far off a stock RX3 engine position we are but I think it could be nearly the full length of the block further back than "standard"

[mullins]

ahh I see. sota like a c notch in an airbagged chassis?

[MikeLMR]

thats the idea ... quite how it works out when we get to building it I don\'t know.

[MikeLMR]

This is a very useful link (photos of most sumps used on 13b\'s and some more !)

http://www.rotaryengineillustrated.com/evolution/oilpan.php

I think our home made version will look a little like the GSL-SE type sump but the shallow part will only be about 4.4mm deep ! (just enough to let the oil run down into the front section of the sump)  

We have plenty of room for a big oil bowl at the back of the engine but no space for a pickup tube or a connection to the front sump !

favourite alternative so far is to use the flexi pipe idea (neater than the photo above!) to connect two bowls of differing depths to control oil surge.

Or just add all the capacity up front with a big wing sump. (with baffles)