Twin rotor Peripheral port

[Grizzly]

If you don\'t mind me asking why would you want to put a P/P twin NA in an FD?

If you get 300RWHP out of it your going to have a small power band? if you stick to a Turbo side port you can easy make 300RWHP and have a bigger power band making it more usable.

Now if you where going old scholl and buy say a Rx2 then i could see why you\'d want to P/P it or run a Bridge, Novelty factor.

Wizy you are right, There is loads writen about making P/P\'s there relitivly easy to make if you know what your doing, but if i was using £700 of new rotor housings i\'d want it done properly by a pro who had lots of experiance running them.

Just changing the subject sligtly didn\'t Pip have a P/P triple Race car?

[stuart wizy]

who do you think bores them out for pip?
ive been down to his place and cant see no boring machine, he must sub it out to a machine shop.
I know what your saying grizly about 700 quid housings but surely all pip does is take the housings down to his local machine shop with drawing and dimensions to get bored.

[banned advertiser]

I should imagine evry tuner does, thats no secret, but I am unable to build and engine so would have to pay someone to do it.
Its great this knowledge being shared and I find it fascinating, please keep it up, but please dont keep on trying to make vendors look expensive. If you put it all in to perpective, you employ 6-8 people and then tell everyone you can rent a warehouse, pay there wages and still build me an engine for £1500.00.
This is a great thread can we keep it tech (not to tech so I can follow) and leave poor Pip alone.
Thanks LOL

[stuart wizy]

im in business my self gary and have employees, rent yard, office etc etc.
Im not trying to make vendors look expensive mate, just sharing my knowledge and experience as a mechanical engineer for over 11 years.
Ive worked in a large machine shop turning boring milling and grinding so i know how long it would take.
I know how much it would cost to have the boring and turning done at a large machine tool firm with over 300 engineers and its 600 quid max.
The build of the engine is then exactly the same method as a side port after blocking side ports up or so ive been told.

[McCARTHY]

If you don\'t mind me asking why would you want to put a P/P twin NA in an FD?

If you get 300RWHP out of it your going to have a small power band? if you stick to a Turbo side port you can easy make 300RWHP and have a bigger power band making it more usable.

Now if you where going old scholl and buy say a Rx2 then i could see why you\'d want to P/P it or run a Bridge, Novelty factor.

i\'m going oldskool with it so no FD involved too hvy for the engine spec i want

[Spartacus]

I should imagine evry tuner does, thats no secret, but I am unable to build and engine so would have to pay someone to do it.
Its great this knowledge being shared and I find it fascinating, please keep it up, but please dont keep on trying to make vendors look expensive. If you put it all in to perpective, you employ 6-8 people and then tell everyone you can rent a warehouse, pay there wages and still build me an engine for £1500.00.
This is a great thread can we keep it tech (not to tech so I can follow) and leave poor Pip alone.
Thanks LOL

I think the point being made is, like any other business or industry if you can do a lot of the work yourself there are savings to be made. If you want to pay a professional to complete the work you naturally expect to have to pay extra for it. You pays your money and you takes your choice :Thumbsup!

[Grizzly]

im in business my self gary and have employees, rent yard, office etc etc.
Im not trying to make vendors look expensive mate, just sharing my knowledge and experience as a mechanical engineer for over 11 years.
Ive worked in a large machine shop turning boring milling and grinding so i know how long it would take.
I know how much it would cost to have the boring and turning done at a large machine tool firm with over 300 engineers and its 600 quid max.
The build of the engine is then exactly the same method as a side port after blocking side ports up or so ive been told.

How do you know Pip didn\'t qoute to build the engine from scrach (New parts) as thats the best way of getting good Compression and winning those extra few hp. I\'m sure if you spoke to him he\'d tell you that a one off engine like this has tobe built right becouse of the Rpm it will run at (becouse the power band will be higher) and theres a matter of warrantee, I think Pip would cover His work?

When i got my engines parts together i did not have alot of change from 10k and thats without building it up? (but i did have an extra rotor)

[McCARTHY]

Your quite right this was all new parts. the shell the engine is going in needs alot of restoration and i\'m going to get that all rebuilt welded etc properly, hence i would like the engine to be the most reliable it can be.

[stuart wizy]

10k on a motor  
cant wait to hear the 3 rotor  at full chat grizly!!
Where in north west are u bud?
its nice to see people getting into pp port rotarys and 3 rotor motors by the way boys.
maybe in a couple of years the rotary boys will be ruling the street class over here!!

[Grizzly]

Yeh my engine cost me alot becouse of its nature (Short block Triple) but tbh i have not touched it in about two years (Lack of funds due to buying a house

Like any project i started off with a Budget in mind and by the time i bought 3 new Rotor housings + porting, three lightened Rotors with the Custom Two pc Crank, over 1k of Apex seals,  Â£800 of balancing and race clearancing it add\'s up fast, and i still need to get the Oil system sorted.

Thats why when some one says they want to build a twin P/P thats going to be NA i think 2pc Crank with center bearing some realy nice lightened Rotors and some of those custom Bolts machined over size and matched to the Plates and housings.... MMMMMM Lots of cash but imagen a P/P NA engine at full chat on a Track at 10.000 rpm. Thats what its all about.:mmmm But it has to be Old school to make it work right  :Laugh

[banned advertiser]

Wow Grizzley
Some project, shame its on hold, totally undrestand why though.
Look forward to seeing you post its under way again.

Keep the thread full of this great chat

[Brett]

I\'ve looked into building a 13B PP in a serious way and can confirm that the Porting is the cheap bit, its the rest of the kit to go with it that pushes the price up :yes

[Grizzly]

LOL Cheap...

£300 for the housing and £150 each port so your looking at £450-£500 each rotor housing before you start if you want it done right.

Thing is there int alot that you can use second hand in a proper race engine, so its always going to be expencive (£250 each end plate £300 center plate,£1200 for a proper E-shaft so you can run your 10,000 rpm o yeh and the £1000 rotors )

[Brett]

Nah, DIY the whole way :yes

[Grizzly]

Yeh i looked into DIY way, but they just don\'t make the HP, the compresion will always be lower on a engine built from USED bits so your going to loos Hp all the way through the rev range. There is also stuff like bearing clearancing and Rotating assembly Ballaning that you just can\'t do in your Garage as a DIYer.

My Triple may yet end up be a semi DIY build though, i\'ve spent the money on all the proper parts but i may assemble it myself knowing its all new and within tolerance.