How should I progress with engine rebuild?

dandan · February 21, 2006, 05:06:33 PM

Hi all,

I\'m planning on starting my first 13b engine rebuild very soon, DVD is sitting waiting at home (cheers Gary) and i\'m very close to having the bank balance to start looking for an engine to work on.

Now what I want to know is:

Should I wait until I have got an engine before I start ordering rebuild kits and parts?

Carl has kindly agreed to look over any engine I do get hold of, so should I wait until he has had a look before I get the credit card out? It seems lots of people get these kits from overseas so I don\'t want to be waiting months for it after I have the engine.

I\'m really eager to get going but obviously want to do it as cost effectively as possible, so don\'t want to order a load of bits I dont need!

What do people think, and also can i have some links and names for purchasing kits/parts/some extra mechanical talent etc?

p.s I dont have a rex to put the engine in yet, so I am in no rush on this one, I want to do it properly.

tr1cky · February 21, 2006, 07:03:39 PM

Dan mate,

Keep me upto date with this please...Would love to give you any help you need with this one mate!! Would gain some experience from it too!

I would say see what Carl says about it...But all rebuild use certain parts, so why not shop around for these bits...If it was me I\'d support a UK tuner for the bits, might cost abit more, but should be alot more forthcoming with help...

How serious you planning??? Porting? If so what stage, etc, etc

Hang on to afew of your bits- such as UIM and Throttle body, etc- will save cash and effort later...You could also start on moddifying and polishing these bits up ready!?

Oh, BTW,your bro said something about a link to his bands music?? Can you send it my way :Thumbs-up and pop round anytime mate!

Rich

dandan · February 21, 2006, 07:33:43 PM

Hey rich,
I meant to publicly sing your praises for coming to help shift the shell the other week, and spilling the beans on your top secret project!

I will def keep you informed about this and you are more than welcome to muck in as much as you want.
Might be going to visit davehg if he starts a build before me, and def going to pay carl a visit (he very rapidly responded to a pm by phoning me today, cheers carl) once i have the engine.
i would like to buy from uk suppliers if possible, cos im impatient and dont like waiting for importing things!
Not got an engine yet so i dont know what bits will be with it when i do, we\'ll have to wait and see, prob will still have a lot of my bits by then, might keep hold of the turbo\'s now I think about it too...

My bro\'s band can be found on //www.myspace.com/wereonlygonnadiemusic but im afraid they have removed the tracks to alter the vocals, should be up again soon though.

stuart wizy · February 21, 2006, 07:55:29 PM

http://rotaryresources.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=DreamShop&file=viewitem&id=15

http://www.atkinsrotary.com/store/customer/home.php?cat=437

i used atkins for apex seals side seals and corner seals
rotary resources for gasket kit and o ring kit
anybody wanting to use 3mm seals in there rotors give me a shout as our miller is now set up for them

alban1973 · February 21, 2006, 08:04:37 PM

hI dandan ,, I am in the same situation, I took the bull by the horns today and anoyed a Mazda dealer for what most of us all want to know. If you look at my posting in the 2nd gen section you will see , Also keep an eye on when I update it with prices. That will tell if it is as cheap to buy in this country or from abroard. Which is what i m trying to find out...

dandan · February 21, 2006, 10:58:28 PM

nice one cheers peeps.

Ain\'t it great when we are all pulling in the same direction?

I\'ll be sure to keep checking up and updating on what I am up to as well.

Martiny · February 22, 2006, 07:18:39 AM

Well you will definitely need a gasket set, so order that first.

What were the symptoms of the bad motor?

stuart wizy · February 22, 2006, 08:21:00 AM

3mm apex seals with 2 piece springs
solid 3mm corner seals
corner seal springs
side seals and springs
all 381 dollars from atkins rotary

full oil o ring set is around 100 dollars
gasket set around 200 dollars
from rotary resources

if you go on any rotary forums in the states most of the builders out there use atkins apex seals- pineaple, racing beat etc use 3mm seals on all 13b rebuilds
your looking at Â£500 for a full overhaul kit and i think you get the rebuild vid in that
dont be scared and have a go mate

stuart wizy · February 22, 2006, 08:32:55 AM

you could buy a stock engine, use new rotor housings and new side housings(aluminium ones) from racing beat, i think they are around 800 dollars each.
this would reduce the weight of the engine by a **** load :Thumbs-up
the std cast iron side housings way a ton

deanflowers · February 22, 2006, 10:07:11 AM

I\'d buy a motor first and strip it down as you may find that you need lots of bits you didnt think you would need, whilst cleaning it all up your rebuild kit can then arrive.

dandan · February 22, 2006, 01:01:05 PM

martiny, i dont have a motor yet, so i dont know what the cause of death will be, i\'ll just see what i can get.
Stuart, not sure I want to go for 3mm tips, if 2mm is good enough for mazda, its good enough for me! plus then i dont need to get the rotors milled etc etc
Also for now I am using this as a learning excercise so ill stick with standard housings, i want to do this as cheaply as possible, maybe future builds will involve bigger tips, different housings, porting etc etc...
I think ill have a view of the dvd tonight, not suprisingly its probably got loads of advice about parts etc on there!
Cheers everyone!

Martiny · February 22, 2006, 01:53:36 PM

Well I dont see the rush if you havent even got an egnine yet!

Have a look at the DVD, it tells you waht to measure and look for to see what parts need replacing.

Common failures, I think are..

1 - Coolant loss caused by corrosion on side housing, so you will propably need a side housing or 2 in this case. If the engine overheated, you will need new Rotor housings ( the chrome one), too
2 - Low compression, caused by Apex seal wear... Apex seals, springs.
3 - Apex seal or corner seal failure ( Usually detonation) - Things will be a mess ! Rotor housing, possibly side housing, mybe a new Rotor or two, and possibly side seals.

On a high mileage engine it would be prudent to replace the oil Rings and rubbers.

antrosser · October 30, 2006, 12:05:45 PM

Quote from: stuart wizyhttp://rotaryresources.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=DreamShop&file=viewitem&id=15

http://www.atkinsrotary.com/store/customer/home.php?cat=437

i used atkins for apex seals side seals and corner seals
rotary resources for gasket kit and o ring kit
anybody wanting to use 3mm seals in there rotors give me a shout as our miller is now set up for them

How much do you charge for boring out from 2mm to 3mm? thanks

stuart wizy · October 30, 2006, 06:31:12 PM

Quote from: antrosserHow much do you charge for boring out from 2mm to 3mm? thanks

to mill 2 rotors out to 3mm with .004" max clearence its Â£100 to do on a cnc machine with a carbide cutter.
the original slot is picked up dead on centre line so the new slot is central to your corner seal bore, this is done for each slot individually.
if u want pics emailing to u with the clock up procedure we use then give us a shout.

Grizzly · October 30, 2006, 07:00:33 PM

Quote from: stuart wizyhttp://rotaryresources.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=DreamShop&file=viewitem&id=15

http://www.atkinsrotary.com/store/customer/home.php?cat=437

i used atkins for apex seals side seals and corner seals
rotary resources for gasket kit and o ring kit
anybody wanting to use 3mm seals in there rotors give me a shout as our miller is now set up for them

Have you had any Problems with RA Water seals? I\'ve been presure Testing every Rebuild i\'ve done recently and they are Poor to put it Mildly, i\'ve stopped using them and gone to OE or Atkins kits (which have OE water seals in), If you compair the Two makes you will see why the RA ones are realy Quite small next to the OE seals.

I still don\'t quite Understand why you like 3mm seals i was told by a number of Tuners that 3mm\'s are for getting bad rotors back to tolarance and have very little or No recorded Performance gain.

While on the subject of seals if you buy Apex\'s from atkins get them Cryo Treated its another thing that does\'nt have alot of Back up but my Old man works in the Aerospace Industry and he raves about it, But more importantly Judge ITO Recomended as he uses them in all his Big HP engines including his own Drag car so thats good enough for me