Learn all about MoTeC (and more) without purchasing anything!

[BlitzBoy]

what Turbo would be big enough to get 600 atw on a 20B?, T88 maybe a Garrett 42/45!!!
http://www.horsepowerinabox.com/HPIAB2/prod81.htm

mmmm want one
I have turbo envy:D

[20B_boy]

Originally posted by BlitzBoy
what Turbo would be big enough to get 600 atw on a 20B?, T88 maybe a Garrett 42/45!!!

I have a 42/45 ready for mine at the mo, altho I dunno whether it will be what I end up with long term.

[Glenn Butcher]

Dave - that\'s great, I think this will be of real benefit to many people...

* 20B Single Turbo M800 ECU file  
To read this file you will need the latest M800 ECU software, which can be downloaded here: http://mirror.motec.com.au/software/release/files/m800_211K3.exe it is 5.3MB in size.

* Data Logging file
Interpreter software can be found here:
http://mirror.motec.com.au/software/release/files/mi_1-29-0023en.exe  5MB in size.[/url]

[BlitzBoy]

You got one Rich!!!
ahhh you lucky thing, did you order it from Oz? what ECU you using to run it?

[Carl]

Hi Dave and Glenn,

I have just been going through this thread and have a couple of comments to make.

One is that dave\'s engine may well have been in a poor state internally after Cadwell,the 20b is such a smooth engine that it is sometimes hard to tell if a tip has gone or is damaged, unlike a 13b.If it was tuned like that, then that in itself could have created more problems with the map.

Secondly,when Pip pulls the engine much more information will be readily available to make a judgement on the state of the build(Which will have a bearing on the cause of failure),that may also give some pretty good clues to as to what went wrong.

Thirdly,the mapping may well have been done to the limits/parameters known for a piston engine which generally are not the same for the rotary engine as those who have tuned them will know.

That being said at the end of the day the people who will be now doing the build and tuning should have a fair amount of say as to what should be done,after all Pip know\'s his stuff and will want the best for the Pink Panther.

The turbo on the car is definitely too small,it should not  really go back together like that.
The fueling needs sorting dramatically and the intercooler is also probably too small too.

Hope this help\'s.
Kind regards
Carl

[Roundabout-Now]

Is there room for a bigger intercooler?

[20B_boy]

Originally posted by BlitzBoy
did you order it from Oz? what ECU you using to run it?

Yes, picked up from aus last year, one of Geffs mates was selling them cheap so it was worth a punt I thought. As many will know tho, its not exactly in use just yet In fact, if u havent picked your motor up from Geff yet - have a look in one of the beer draws when u do

It will be run by MicroTech in the first instance btw.

I would be very interested to see the inside of that engine Dave...as I\'m sure a few others would too!

[BlitzBoy]

Rich  you just reminded me to ring Geoff later this week on the status of my engine.
Ahh now I remember when I dropped off my engine Geoff showing me a huge turbo, didnt realise it was yours, damn that thing is big!!!

Maybe the Pink Panther should consider getting something similar to power his triple Rotor and sell me his T04R

[20B_boy]

Yes, that will have been mine. And I will have been the hippy putting the bolts in the engine stand while u and geff were breaking your backs holding the thing :rollin

I was going to suggest to Dave that he\'d probably be able to shift his T04 pretty easily, on the presumption that it wasnt injured during engine demise. Nice turbo. For a 13B

Any way, I digress; Carl, what sort of intercooler do you have in mind? the Trust one he has isnt particularly small, is it? Whats Gary have on his car with the 42R? HKS GT?

[maximtaylor]

Very interesting reading, thanks for the data!

A few questions though, for those in the know of 20b\'s, motecs etc!!!

1) I notice split timing is 5 degrees flat under load, but the table only goes to 1 bar (200 kpa), whereas most other tables, such as inj and ign tables go to 300 kpa (2 bar). So what happens to split above 1 bar?

2) Where is peak torque on a 3 rotor, and what do they rev to?
On a 2 rotor, running 17 degrees advance at 5500 rpm / 1 bar would concern me!!!

There\'s probably loads of functions I haven\'t found yet, that might make corrections to the numbers I\'m seeing so far

This will keep me interested for ages!!!

Max

[20B_boy]

Stock they make about 285lb/ft at 2200rpm, and peak is just under 300lb/ft at about 3k. And they pretty much make that or near to it all the way to 7k-ish which is about redline from the factory...

[MikeLMR]

Cool !

will have a play with the software now I have somthing to load into it.

Cheers,
             Mike

[Glenn Butcher]

Max!!

Yes - well spotted mate, the timing split was something that I had a few comments on (as in it not being enough).  I \'THINK\' what happens is that the values get interpolated to match that of the Ignition/Fuel Site maps - not 100% sure on this.

But to change it to go to 300 kPa, on the menu go to:

Adjust --> Site Set-up --> Load 11 (Ign Load sites 11).  Set the highest value to 300kPa (on the far right).  Then you can either Interpolate them by going to: Tools --> Interpolate Horizontal Row, it will do exactly that.  Or you can just type the values in.

Then go back to Adjust --> Rotary Split, and you will see the value now up to 300kPa.


Again well spotted, the timing was far too advanced for pump fuel.  On a 3rotor - peak torque is much lower than a 13B, so it may have been detonating for quite some time.


When you get a chance, have a look at the log file via the Interpreter.  You will see that the Intake Temps are really quite high (as Carl has said a better intercooler would help this).  But again with the ECU you can compensate for intake temps/engine temps - you name it.

For Compensations, (in the ECU manager) go to Adjust --> Ignition --> Compensations --> Air Temp Comp where you will find another table.  This is also something that could have helped prevent extra stress on the engine.


It is good stuff isn\'t it!

[Roundabout-Now]

Not sure how clear this will be (no scanner, so digi photo), but here\'s the power graph for the Pink Panther the week before the engine went. Peak torque seems to be coming in very high (for a 20B).

[Roundabout-Now]

Just to make it a bit clearer, here\'s one with big labels:D