installed twins now just grind grind grind

[monterx7]

well new single clutch kit is installed and still fooked......

bled the .... out of the hyrdro bits and thenk it actually worked for a few pumps...so im ordering new master and slave cylinder just incase, that way if its not one i have the other already....will let you know what happens in a week or 2.

[m1tch]

Did you fit a longer slave cylinder arm for the twin plate clutch? im not using one on mine and the biting point is right at the bottom, I have an ORC 709 which come with a longer rod due to this, if the rod isn\'t short enough you aren\'t going to be able to move the plates apart....

Also, by grinding, do you mean the sound the clutch plates make when the pedal is down or do you mean the box is grinding? The clutch should rattle and sound like a bag of spanners when the pedal is down, should help diagnose if the clutch plates are correctly disengaging

[monterx7]

didnt install a longer cylinder arm due to alot of people running the twins with everything else stock.  box grinding, when i had the twins in stalled they did have the normal rattling with clutch pedal pressed in.

[BlitzBoy]

cant believe u didnt do the master\\slave cylinder seals first before trying a different clutch :xconfused , doing a seal replacement is far easier job then changing the clutch and flywheel lol

[monterx7]

didnt think of which was easiest.  the twins were something i just had lying around the garage but were very used.  so figured why not see if it is the twins and get a new clutch at the same time..........so where can i get a slave cylinder rebuild kit locally?

[monterx7]

swapped out clutch master and slave cylinder with no luck at all......still grinding with motor running when trying to go into gear...but goes into gear with motor not running.  so now the only thing that hasnt been changed out is the gearbox...not so what the hell is going on in there......

any ideas?

[pdtaylor18]

Does this do this in every gear?  reverse gear?

If you are certain that the clutch disc and all other bits such as pressure plate, bearing are all new then there are a few more options left:

Air in the system
Worn pilot bearing
Wrong pedal adjustment

Does the grinding happen when you shift up or down?
Also, an extreme faulty synchronizer can cause an impossible shifting into a particular gear. However, when the affected gear is the first gear and the grinding sound only occurs when shifting from a stop position, but not when downshifting, its possible that the problem is too much clutch pedal “free play”. Free play is the distance that a clutch pedal moves before the clutch start to disengage. In a case of grinding sound occurrence, even when the clutch pedal is fully depressed, the clutch is not fully disengaged that is why when there is a grinding sound when shifting into first gear.

[monterx7]

now that i read that pete, it only grind going into reverse but could not get it into any other gear.  i will go back and re-bleed it and play with pedal adjustment.  will post up my findings

thanks pete

[monterx7]

well bled the master/slave 3 times...from full to low 3 times.....still nothing.  pulled the shifter and replaced the shifter bushing just to make sure the older ones werent screwing things up and of course nothing

[pdtaylor18]

Then i would say that its the pilot bearing, lot of work and you will need a puller if it is that. Its the only thing common now to all your problems with the old clutch and this one taking into account all the items that have been replaced/new.
More so if the gearbox was ok before.
The only other thing it can be and this was mentioned before is the clutch fork itself,these can and have got bent in previous cases of clutch problems.  If you have to take the box off then make sure your release bearing slides nicely along the shaft and thats its not sticking. Was the release bearing new?

[the hat]

im not sure about the fcs pilot bearing but on nearly every other car all you need is something that is a snug fit in the centre then pack the centre hole full of grease and hit your snug fitting punch in and the bearing will pop out

[monterx7]

ive got the mazdatrix pilot bearing puller and installer so changing it out shouldnt be too much trouble.  i see where your coming from pete, i remember reading about how it may cause this issue and pulled the gearbox to find nothing wrong with the pilot bearing at all.  the pilot bearing thats in there right now is the third one since this all started.  and ive installed the bearings using this installer tool:

pilot bearing installer


the pilot bearings and seal that im using are from the mazda dealer, and ive test fitted them on the gearbox before installing them on the motor.  

does anyone know how far/deep the pilot bearing should sit in the hole?

[pdtaylor18]

On the end of the pilot bearing is a seal, that needs to be doing its job and as long as that is tucked in nicely then that really sets how far the thing goes in. It does not have to go in all the way.
I never had a puller when I did mine and ended up cutting the thing out with a Dremmel, that really was not the best route but it worked. It was still one of the worse jobs I have done on the FC as there is very little room. A puller is by far the best option of which you have anyway. To be on the 3rd bearing though stinks of something else wrong, I will have a look to see if I have a spare clutch fork.

Not sure on the best way for you to go now as you have tried almost every combination of solutions and new parts that would fix this problem. Is there oil in the gearbox?
I am at Marham this weekend so drop me a text when you free and i will come over and help if you want?

[monterx7]

using that mazdatrix pilot bearing installer puts it at the correct spot.  found some info and pics and seems mine is where most are....hopefully that makes sense:)

guess ill head to base and mess with the clutch pedal adjustment and see if that changes anything at all.  i hate pulln the gearbox just to see that nothing is damaged or missing.  theres gotta be something im missing here

[monterx7]

Whenever you grind a gear does the sound normally come from the shifter area?