FD Antilock Brakes - Do they really work??

[Timmy]

I decided to see if my abs worked the other day, didn\'t realise how close i was to engaging abs on spirited drives, it does come on a touch to early.

[Nik da Greek]

ABS on my FD is shocking!i Hate ABS with a passion in general.. Almost caused me to crash many times when its kicked in.. Once made me judder that far forward i had to mount the curb to not hit the back of a sudden stopping car. Where as if i had of lost traction and slid i would of stopped well before the rear of the guys car.put it this way.. if i had time to think i cant stop and mount the curb then u can imagine how long the ABS was juddering for... It just feels like when the abs kicks in it takes you 20 times longer to stop. as i would prefer to loose traction and control the skid myself. Hard to explain but I know what I meen.

Not convinced by all of this, tbh. Since I have been in the unenviable situation of locking up an FD at speed when the ABS computer was duff, I think you wouldn\'t be stopping any quicker/neater/more controlled than if you had working ABS. This isn\'t conjecture, just my own personal experience and apart from badly flat-spotted tyres it cost me a perfectly good set of pants and a big lump of seat foam where my bum took a big bite out of it lol :rollin

[berniec]

from my experience abs is a good thing.

i used to have a car without abs and in the rain esp or normal road use, if you needed to brake really hard you would skid and you have almost no control in avoiding a crash if the wheels lock. you skid in a straight line. abs allows you to manouver the car around the obstacle while still braking.

ive only ever needed to brake really hard in my fd once. it happened about 3 weeks ago and the wheels locked once for a split second i was braking that hard. lucky for me the abs was there as the normal way of stopping skidding in a car without abs. ie. pumping the brake pedal would certainly have seen me into the back of the car that pulled out in front of me.

ive never really noticed any pedal vibration or noticed it kick in but i know its there now.

[Papercup]

If you want to try it without then simply turn the car off and remove the ABS fuse from under the bonnet. Drive around and see what you think. For a daily driver i\'d probably leave it in but i learnt to drive without it (I am 36) and think it kicks in too early. I\'ve left the fuse out. I haven\'t locked a front wheel yet (and i have 6-pot APs).
 
I had a Clio 172 Cup a few years back and they don\'t have it. Did a lot of miles, went to the \'ring twice and never locked a wheel. It was comical listening to the kids on the Cliosport forum deciding amongst themselves that cars without it were dangerous and to buy a full-fat 172 or you\'d die.
 
Worth mentioning that as Renault designed the 172 Cup without ABS they had to adjust the brake bias to give less to the rear to stop them locking, and all 172 Cups will get an advisory at MOT time for weak rear brakes, which can be ignored.
 
This backs up something i heard, that cars don\'t have proper brake bias worked out any more, the manufacturer simply puts ABS on and leaves that to sort it out.
 
This is apparently true with the Rex. With my 6-pot APs you\'d think i\'d lock the front wouldn\'t you? I went out the other night and did a succession of \'stamp on the brakes going down a hill at high speed\' and found that at about 30mph or so the rears would lock, suggesting too much bias to the rear. So now i need adjustable brake bias.
 
I found that I couldn\'t lock the fronts (without being ridiculous). Yet turn the ABS on again and i can feel it working, at the front as well i think.
 
Anyway, i prefer the car with the ABS off. I\'ll leave it all there and the fuse out so i can enable it again come sale time or if i decide to start commuting in all weathers
 
 
Andy
 
 
 
p.s. Brake Spec:
 
Front 6-pot APs, 330x32 AP disks, Pagid yellows
 
Rear standard disk and caliper, Hawk HP+ pads

[iaint]

Almost caused me to crash many times when its kicked in.. Once made me judder that far forward i had to mount the curb to not hit the back of a sudden stopping car. Where as if i had of lost traction and slid i would of stopped well before the rear of the guys car.put it this way.. if i had time to think i cant stop and mount the curb then u can imagine how long the ABS was juddering for... It just feels like when the abs kicks in it takes you 20 times longer to stop. as i would prefer to loose traction and control the skid myself. Hard to explain but I know what I meen.

Sorry if this makes me sound like an old killjoy BUT it does sound like the problem might be traced back from the ABS to a more biological part of the system...

[Aubec]

Papercup, you are more likely to lock the rears under most circumstances, the fronts have a lot more traction under braking because the weight of the car is on them - the rears go light, which is why they lock easier - the friction between the pads and disks is way way way more than that between the tyres and road.

That\'s the problem the 172/182 have - there was already feck all weight over the rears, and when you slam the anchors on the only thing keeping them in contact with the road is the rear springs.

[Timmy]

This is apparently true with the Rex. With my 6-pot APs you\'d think i\'d lock the front wouldn\'t you? I went out the other night and did a succession of \'stamp on the brakes going down a hill at high speed\' and found that at about 30mph or so the rears would lock, suggesting too much bias to the rear. So now i need adjustable brake bias.
 
I found that I couldn\'t lock the fronts (without being ridiculous). Yet turn the ABS on again and i can feel it working, at the front as well i think.
 

I think this may have to do with the increase in progression of haveing 2 extra pot\'s you need more brake fluid to fill the extra 2 pots and get to locking point.
You shouldn\'t have problem with standard calipers without abs.