Looking at FCs, potentially stupid questions

[Nocturnal]

Hi everyone, I\'m new here and currently driving a somewhat feminine MX5. I\'ve wanted an RX7 for years, but every time I\'ve come close, someone always puts me off and I end up with something else instead. I\'m due to join the RAF in 6 months, so if I do settle on one, I won\'t be in the market for some time yet. I absolutely adore my car at the moment, but I feel I\'ve reached its potential, and I don\'t want to ruin in it by simply throwing power at it. My feeling was that I\'d rather buy a 7 and uprate the chassis, leaving the power alone for now.
 
So, onto my questions. If they\'ve been answered before you\'ll have to forgive me, I\'ve read conflicting information on just about every site I\'ve been on. :3Confused
 
-What are they like to drive? My MX5 is modified so the comparison is likely a little unfair, but I\'m talking in terms of grip. Primarily I\'m talking a tin-top Turbo-II here. My driving history is effectively two MK1 MR2s, a Stage 2 200SX (S13), and this MX5.
 
-Are they expensive to insure generally speaking? Is there a major difference between insuring an import and a UK spec car?
 
-Are they expensive to run? The main horror stories I\'ve heard are regards drinking oil and breaking down spectacularly, is there much truth to these?
 
-The common one I expect, but rebuilds? Are the horror stories true? How often can I expect one to last before I have to spend a ridiculous amount to get it working again?
 
-Are aftermarket parts easy to come by? It\'s likely the car will end up primarily as a track car, so I\'m thinking in terms of a roll cage, adjustable coil-overs, wheels etc. I\'d also be looking for advice on an exhaust that is free-flowing, but quiet enough to pass track noise regs.
 
-How basic are they? Coming from an MX5, I have no ABS, A/C etc, PAS is about the only luxury I have. I haven\'t had a car yet with ABS and I\'m not sure what it\'s like on track?
 
-Also, this is a big one, but does anyone live in/around West Yorkshire who wouldn\'t mind taking me for a quick blast in one? As much as I\'ve always loved the looks/sound of FCs, I don\'t think I could live with myself if I chopped the \'5 in for one and then didn\'t like it.
 
-Finally (for now, heh), where\'s the best place to buy one from? I\'m not sure why, but Pistonheads seems to have deleted the RX7 option from the classifieds on this PC, and the only thing I can find on the trader/ebay are EGis and convertibles, of which I don\'t really want either. I suppose I\'m quite picky that I either want a white or black tin-top, with any modifications either being minimal or to the chassis. Am I better off waiting for a good one to come up in the UK, or having one imported from Japan myself?
 
Thanks for reading all that if you could be bothered, I\'d understand if you couldn\'t! :Thumbsup! Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I\'m not sure why, but I feel compelled to put a shot of the 5 up. If it\'s gaying up the page too much, let me know and I\'ll take it down!
 

 
Cheers!

[dthebuk]

First off.....DAAAAAm your mx5 looks awesome!.

anyway

Handling. With uprated suspension bits it should be much better than an s13, not too sure about the mr2\'s though, all i hear is that they spin out alot . RX7\'s in my experience on stock suspension, are very predictable on the limit, though if you throw the back end out too quickly it can be extremely hard to catch due to the lack of steering lock and the low moment of inertia these cars have (due the the majority of weight being between the front and back wheels). The seating position is also very similar to the mk2 mx-5’s, havnt driven and early one so I wouldn’t know

Insurance. Im 20 with 3 points and 2 years NCB and i pay 900 on a N/A (modded) and ive been quoted at 1500 on a TII, which is also modded. Thats with HIC. Imports are usually more, though ive heard ove people paying less for FC\'s than civics.

Running. Well it depends how you drive. Ive had 30mpg out of my TII. Though i was going around 40-50mph on the motor way. If you\'re bombing it around on boost its probably more like 15mpg, so i\'d say an average of about 20. Oil is aboult 1litre per 1000miles. In a year and a half of ownership my N/A has broken down due to two faults. One was a nakered starter motor, the other was some dodge electrical problem. The TII broke down within a week over ownership due to the clutch dying. Ive never had a problem with these cars because they are rotary.

Rebuilds. On a stockish TII you can get 150k miles if you try hard. Most common cause of failure is failure of ancillaries, such as the fuel, oil and water pumps. You can ditch the oil pump and run a pre-mix, and re-wire the fuel pump to for electrical saftey. If you\'re looking at big power, the engine life will decrease. If your lucky and dont throw a tip, rebuilds can be reasonable cheap, as you can re-use a lot of parts.

Parts. They\'re reasonable. Roll cages will pretty much be custom, coilovers are slightly harder to come buy. I usually see about 1 or 2 sets for sale a month. Though drift works are selling HSD coilovers for the FC for around 650-700, which are very very highly rated. For an exhuast, theres always the racing beat option, but they are pretty pricey, probably better to get you\'re own one made or buy one off someone else. Also if you\'re after an LSD, you can fit the torsen one (1.5 way) from an FD in the FC TII diff housing.

Luxuries: Depends how much you spend really, some have ABS, A/C and P/S. I don\'t know what ABS is like on these cars though. They\'re pretty good cars, they cost around 10-15k 20 years ago.

Buying. The problem with importing at the moment is the the price. You can get some very nicely modifyed ones from japan, but the condition of the engine will pretty much be unknown. So if you get one from jap land i\'d budget in a possible rebuild. In the UK i would look on here, pistonheads or driftworks. Ive seen some nice ones on DW, that havnt been drifted. So personally, i\'d wait for a goodun to come up.

As for tips.. Let it warm up before driving it hard, let it idle before turning it off if you\'ve been driving on boost (you probably know this). Let it warm up before you switch it off



Oh, and welcome to MRC

[peterwolds]

-What are they like to drive? My MX5 is modified so the comparison is likely a little unfair, but I\'m talking in terms of grip. Primarily I\'m talking a tin-top Turbo-II here. My driving history is effectively two MK1 MR2s, a Stage 2 200SX (S13), and this MX5.near 50/50 weight run as on rails,watch rear in the wet coming off bends dont power too early RWD will bite you
 
-Are they expensive to insure generally speaking? Is there a major difference between insuring an import and a UK spec car?uk a bit cheaper,depends on age points claims as any car reasonable to insuredepending also on power better than an evo i had
  with care
-Are they expensive to run? The main horror stories I\'ve heard are regards drinking oil and breaking down spectacularly, is there much truth to these?silly rumours look after car service regularly,use a bit of oil not excessive
 
-The common one I expect, but rebuilds? Are the horror stories true? How often can I expect one to last before I have to spend a ridiculous amount to get it working again?answer as above look after it my FD3S had done 55000 miles only blew up when new owner played about with boost
 
-Are aftermarket parts easy to come by? It\'s likely the car will end up primarily as a track car, so I\'m thinking in terms of a roll cage, adjustable coil-overs, wheels etc. I\'d also be looking for advice on an exhaust that is free-flowing, but quiet enough to pass track noise regs.parts available on here privately/vendors/ebay
 
-How basic are they? Coming from an MX5, I have no ABS, A/C etc, PAS is about the only luxury I have. I haven\'t had a car yet with ABS and I\'m not sure what it\'s like on track?only dragged FD3S so cant comment on track
 
-Also, this is a big one, but does anyone live in/around West Yorkshire who wouldn\'t mind taking me for a quick blast in one? As much as I\'ve always loved the looks/sound of FCs, I don\'t think I could live with myself if I chopped the \'5 in for one and then didn\'t like it.wrong area & mine is standard totaly
 
-Finally (for now, heh), where\'s the best place to buy one from? I\'m not sure why, but Pistonheads seems to have deleted the RX7 option from the classifieds on this PC, and the only thing I can find on the trader/ebay are EGis and convertibles, of which I don\'t really want either. I suppose I\'m quite picky that I either want a white or black tin-top, with any modifications either being minimal or to the chassis. Am I better off waiting for a good one to come up in the UK, or having one imported from Japan myself?buy off here as you can trace history as i did for FD3S & FC
 
Thanks for reading all that if you could be bothered, I\'d understand if you couldn\'t! :Thumbsup! Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I\'m not sure why, but I feel compelled to put a shot of the 5 up. If it\'s gaying up the page too much, let me know and I\'ll take it down! car looks good
 

 
Cheers![/QUOTE]

[Prof]

I think most of it has been covered.  The RX7 FC is a similar drive to the MX5 in tems of handling because both are rear wheel drive and both have near 50/50 weight balance.
 
In terms of oil usage and mainentance - these cars use oil as part of the lubrication process, and unlike a piston engine, the internals of the combustion chamber need lubricating and this oil will be burnt off.  In general this equates to about 1L every 1000 miles.  Other than that, the usual maintenance tasks need to be done the same as any older car.
 
If you\'re going to modify the car for more power, you can expect lower engine life, but with good modifications you can make keep this to a minimum.
 
Weak areas of the standard car:
 
Fuel pump / wiring - the original wiring is quite thin and the voltage at the pump can often be a lot lower than 12V at higher engine output.  The pumps are also getting on a bit.  Consider a pump upgrade (FD pump or Walbro) or at the least rewire it.
 
Spark Leads:
 
Again due to age, the stock plug wires will most likely need replacing.  Magnecor make some good aftermarket wires - well worth it.
 
Oil Metering Pump:
 
This is a fairly critical part of the stock engine - people who track / drag these cars tend to eliminate this and run premix - but you need an aftermarket ECU if you do that, as the ECU goes into limp mode if it detects any failures in the OMP circuits.  A new wiring harness for the engine can help, servicing the OMP can also be a good idea if it\'s staying.
 
Emissions & Rat\'s Nest:
 
There are a lot of small vacuum pipes under the Plenum / Throttle body which sits under the intercooler on a stock Turbo II - there is a mix of hard pipes and rubber hoses - and these rubber hoses can perish over time - It\'s a good idea to replace these with new ones if staying stock, although most of it can be eliminated if going for a race setup.  The emissions stuff can be taken off the car to simplify the rats nest a little, but this can effect getting the car through an MOT on the HC/CO tests.

[Nocturnal]

Thanks guys, some really interesting information there too! Just to clarify on some points...
 

If you\'re bombing it around on boost its probably more like 15mpg, so i\'d say an average of about 20.

Is it wise to run these engines strictly on V-Power too, or are the ECUs only mapped for 95RON fuel anyway?
 

Also if you\'re after an LSD, you can fit the torsen one (1.5 way) from an FD in the FC TII diff housing.

Do any FCs come with an LSD stock, or is this the only route to go down?
 

but you need an aftermarket ECU if you do that

How \'aftermarket\' are we talking, something piggy-back (E-Manage or similar) or stand alone? What are the advantages of running \'pre-mix\', you\'ll have to forgive my ignorance here, oil pumps etc is a part of the engine I haven\'t directly dealt with so far.
 
Thanks again for the info though, it\'s all bang on what I was looking for. Out of interest, how much would I expect to pay for a decent T-II? Has the recession affected the value of these cars/parts at all?
 

Roll cages will pretty much be custom

Regarding this point, do any manufacturers (Cusco/Carbing etc) make a ready-made cage, or am I strictly going down the Safety Devices route. I only ask as my buddy just had one made up for his Integra, and despite the ball-ache of it not fitting first time, it was hugely expensive!!

[dthebuk]

Yup, i\'d use vpower only on turbo rotaries. BP ultimate in emergencies, but mainly v power

I believe a few come with VLSD\'s, though these are imports? (back up?)
There are other aftermarket lds\'s you can use, the FD one is the cheapest option.

ECU. I just pm\'d prof with the same question
Pre-mix. By running premix, firstly you\'re not depending on the OMP. There is also an argument that the apex seals get a better lubrication. Search for "premix" in the technical stickies section, theres a good thread on it i believe.

I think yo can pick up a lighly modified TII for around £2k with a recentish rebuild in good nick. My TII cost £1k, but ive had to spend a similar amount on getting it up to a decent spec, this included replacing a clutch.

TBH for cages i would ask on driftworks. Theres a few FC owners on here (from dirftworks) That have welded cages. I really don\'t know alot about cages so ask them

[peterwolds]

Thanks guys, some really interesting information there too! Just to clarify on some points...
 

 
Is it wise to run these engines strictly on V-Power too, or are the ECUs only mapped for 95RON fuel anyway?mines totaly stock runs 95 ron
 

 
Do any FCs come with an LSD stock, or is this the only route to go down?
 

 
How \'aftermarket\' are we talking, something piggy-back (E-Manage or similar) or stand alone? What are the advantages of running \'pre-mix\', you\'ll have to forgive my ignorance here, oil pumps etc is a part of the engine I haven\'t directly dealt with so far.recommended but have run rotaries for 3 years never premixed
 
Thanks again for the info though, it\'s all bang on what I was looking for. Out of interest, how much would I expect to pay for a decent T-II? Has the recession affected the value of these cars/parts at all?2nd hand market poor if you want a good cabriolet see pete taylors advert cracking car under £4000 a bargain although not a track car its a beauty
 

 
Regarding this point, do any manufacturers (Cusco/Carbing etc) make a ready-made cage, or am I strictly going down the Safety Devices route. I only ask as my buddy just had one made up for his Integra, and despite the ball-ache of it not fitting first time, it was hugely expensive!!

go for it a rare car

[Prof]

but you need an aftermarket ECU if you do that

How \'aftermarket\' are we talking, something piggy-back (E-Manage or similar) or stand alone? What are the advantages of running \'pre-mix\', you\'ll have to forgive my ignorance here, oil pumps etc is a part of the engine I haven\'t directly dealt with so far.

You will need a standalone ECU to eliminate the OMP - as even a piggy back will still need the stock ECU and that needs to see the OMP in circuit. The Microtec doesn\'t drive the OMP at all - so you need to either remove it and go premix or go with the mechanical OMP from the earlier series 4 FC. The Power FC from Apexi allows you to run the OMP or eliminate it as you chose.
 
I have retained my OMP, but have an adaptor from Rotary aviation that allows you to feed 2 stroke oil directly to the oil injectors - elimintating the requirement to burn engine oil.
 
Running premix (2 stroke) is considered better by some, as this oil is designed to be burned in a combustion chamber unlike engine oil.  It doesn\'t leave behind residue to the same extent as the main lubricating oil

[Nocturnal]

Thanks, I think I\'m starting to get the idea. To be honest, apart from the obvious, it doesn\'t sound that different than running my S13 was. Now all I need is to find someone willing/local...

[vonrumble]

i want your mx5 gimme lol

[Nocturnal]

Haha, I\'m hoping to keep the 5 as a dedicated track toy, and run a 7 to replace what the 5 does now (a bit of both). But if someone came along with a nice Turbo-II and wanted a swap...
 
Just another shot for those who like it, how the wheels used to look before the UK weather shafted them
 

[grinder]

im not local as such - but where abouts in yorkshire are you ( didnt read the whole thread ! )

[Nocturnal]

I\'m between Leeds and Wakefield, don\'t mind a bit of a drive though! Just want to get a feel for one really

[TiddlesRX7]

You could always pop to one of the meets. Not sure when the next one is yet (haven\'t set a date), but if you come over I\'ll take you out for a run in mine. It\'s not the cleanest example but it goes well!

[Nocturnal]

Yeah I\'d be up for that, thanks! Just let me know