Hey all, here\'s a simple question :P
How to widen the rear FD axel??
I am a long way away from my FD for referal but I was wondering if there is any success story\'s on how do to this. I don\'t want to simply add spacers as its only masking the desired out come. The outcome being something around 125mm wider each side!! From memory, the only thing that is really stopping this from happening is the drive shafts! The rest of the arms can be lengthened through cut and shut welding. Again, without any major knowledge in the subject I am open to suggestions on being realistic and safe. But the thing that\'s bothering me the most is longer drive shafts.
Any information would be great,
Cheers
Lee
Why Lee, OOI? :)
Will I have been messing around a lot with the steering for my drifter and the car has now ended up around 125mm wider (more at the base/ground level because of a little excessive camber) so I have a very disproportionate axel width FD! I would like to achieve 75mm wider rear so a max of 50mm spacer would be used. You have to push the boat out to be different I guess!
And sorry, what\'s OOI? Not so clued up on short hand!
If you can extend all the other parts of the rear easy enough then the drive shafts won\'t be a problem. You can have them made to suit your needs to whatever length you want.
I actually think the longer shafts would be the easier part, extending the IRS would be a pain in the arse as you would be changing a tonne load of geometry.
Why not get better offsets and wider wheels so you don\'t have to run a huge spacer?
My knowledge on IRS Geometry is quite limited too. I currently have 12 identical rims for the rear of the car so it keeps an even feel at the rear. So for that Reason, a one off mod to the rear of the car would work out cheaper than gettin another 12 rims! But I am assuming I will have gains in the feel of the car on track? Maybe this isn\'t so?
I am a little dubious about having lengthing drive shafts. What\'s the precautions I should insure if I have someone construct a pair? What\'s the proper procedures?
The way I see it if your Increasing the width of the car then you should be increasing the amount of rubber to gain the effect of the wider stance. A wider car is going to have better cornering ability, just look at the LMP cars, they\'re as wide as they are long.
Buying new rims will probably cheaper than altering all of the suspension arms and shafts IMO.
There is a guy on the other site building an fd for hill climbing with a 20B in it and he is going to be altering all the suspension arms as the kit he has built is monsterously wide. Maybe worth asking him how he\'s going about it?
Cheers man, well the front is already completed to allow the extra lock, and I\'m only running 195 (pass on offset). The rear is 215 (pass on offset). To be honest, I\'m still pretty much running a standard engine setup so stock 1994 type R power but with the front being already so beefed out, I though I should try and even the score.
Well IDS aside, what\'s the golden rules in drive shaft extension?
Golden rule would be get a driveshaft shop to make them for you. Things can be extended etc then treated to be as strong as the originals if not stronger, or complete one offs made.
215s?! That\'s very slim, I ran 235 on front of my fd and 265 on the rear, no arch rolling. So you missing out on a lot of width on your wheels. With the right width wheel and offset you can achieve what your wanting, along with arch rolling and arch extensions. Even using 265s you have gained 50mm width either side.
However..... If your drifting and paying for your rubber it\'s going to cost you a lot more cash for wider tyres :(
well there is no such thing as an FD rear axel given that the FD is IRS (independant rear Suspension) . You would have to totally rework the suspension pick up points as well as the toelinks,the bracket mounts for the hubs, wishbones mounting points,custom driveshafts etc etc , re do the geomatry , a lot of work and money!!!!
The easy and cheapest way to make the rear track wider is with wheel offsets and spacers Im afraid
Quote from: BlitzBoy;847919well there is no such thing as an FD rear axel given that the FD is IRS (independant rear Suspension) . You would have to totally rework the suspension pick up points as well as the toelinks,the bracket mounts for the hubs, wishbones mounting points,custom driveshafts etc etc , re do the geomatry , a lot of work and money!!!!
The easy and cheapest way to make the rear track wider is with wheel offsets and spacers Im afraid
This is what I\'m getting at, the FD rear suspension struts mounts onto the upper arm iirc, to alter the width out you are going to have to change the position of the suspension strut tower otherwise you are going to alter the suspension to account for the extra leverage from the longer armse etc.
Best bet is wider wheels and deep dish rims, with rolled arches and arch extensions. OR just use spacers, easy simple and most important CHEAP.
Quote from: Grant Monkhouse;847918Golden rule would be get a driveshaft shop to make them for you. Things can be extended etc then treated to be as strong as the originals if not stronger, or complete one offs made.
215s?! That\'s very slim, I ran 235 on front of my fd and 265 on the rear, no arch rolling. So you missing out on a lot of width on your wheels. With the right width wheel and offset you can achieve what your wanting, along with arch rolling and arch extensions. Even using 265s you have gained 50mm width either side.
However..... If your drifting and paying for your rubber it\'s going to cost you a lot more cash for wider tyres :(
Cheers, paying for rubber is a big problem, as with anyone, and going through between 8 and 12 new tyres an outing, it\'s a little expensive. Plus, with only a standard engine, I just don\'t have the power in 3rd gear as it is with the 215s so wider rubber isn\'t really going to help!! Wider offset would help but it\'s still adding load to the bearings.
Quote from: BlitzBoy;847919well there is no such thing as an FD rear axel given that the FD is IRS (independant rear Suspension) . You would have to totally rework the suspension pick up points as well as the toelinks,the bracket mounts for the hubs, wishbones mounting points,custom driveshafts etc etc , re do the geomatry , a lot of work and money!!!!
The easy and cheapest way to make the rear track wider is with wheel offsets and spacers Im afraid
Quote from: Grant Monkhouse;847921This is what I\'m getting at, the FD rear suspension struts mounts onto the upper arm iirc, to alter the width out you are going to have to change the position of the suspension strut tower otherwise you are going to alter the suspension to account for the extra leverage from the longer armse etc.
Best bet is wider wheels and deep dish rims, with rolled arches and arch extensions. OR just use spacers, easy simple and most important CHEAP.
Apologies for referring to the rear as an axel. Lengthening the arms really just won\'t cut it then. Fair enough. I understand the extra leavening in the suspension, but that aside, assuming the lengthened drive shafts are affordable, and the lengthening of the arms are within capability, could it be made drivable without moving the strut tops? (I am running a relatively decent coil over set)
I don\'t think adding to the current 50mm spacers is an option really. I may be pushing things to far and to be honest, I can\'t afford deep dish rims or have toe power to run dip dish with a larger tyre.
And apologies as I\'m sure you can see, geometry is not something I have great knowledge in
Run higher tyre pressures, if your struggling 3rd gear pulls
It would depend how you modified the arms for the stock suspension mount points, if the bottom moved out it wouldn\'t be at the same angle, would compress differently, etc. it\'s a lot of work to gain something that can be gained easier and faster ways
Cheers, I have been playing with pressures, up to 50psi. It\'s a standard 1994 so there\'s no grate abundance of power.
Thanks lads, I to believe that it is more difficult to widen the rack than just lengthening arms. Excluding the ability to go with deeper dish wheels and higher pressures inside the tyres, I don\'t think increasing he spacers is acceptable either?
Is there such a thing as a safe maximum size your spacers could be? surly 50mm is about the limit or could you push wider?