Well I\'ve wired in the emanage blue and believe I\'ve set it up right, started the real time management and set it to record and fired the car.. Starts, revs up and dies just like how it did with the safc... :( so looking at what was recorded it seems that the air flow signal in and out had a maximum voltage of 5v when it cut out, now from what was worked out last time, uk N/A\'s have a 12v afm which, the setup going by the manual will be for 5v systems. Now if I\'m right, the sa/fb\'s have a 12v afm so anyone who has setup an emb on one of them might be quite useful :)
Apart from that, anyone got any help?
Or perhaps fit a turbo II air flow meter?
oh would that work? like just bolt it in? but the question is, where would i get one from :P
does anyone know what the differences are in the "MZ_FL_1(to 8 i think)? without bring up the documents i believe it says set it to MZ_FL_4 but im wondering what it might be for an older rx7?
I\'m not very mechanical minded, nor do i claim to know a lot, so the following scentence could be bull carp. What i am not sure of is what you intend to gain from the emanage on the EGI, my understanding of the Emanage is that they\'re inteded to increase and re-tune fueling for different cars (usually FI) and with the EGI running rich anyway an increase in fueling isn\'t going to help you and will more likely increase flooding. If you decide to tune it to get a better mpg then your going to be increasing the risk of running lean, i guess my point is the fun your having now coupled to the costs that could be involved if you try and get it mapped properly for very very minimal gains point to the question. Is this worth your time, money and effort when you could be spending it on something more worth while? Say upgraded headers and full exhaust system, or coilovers and some decent tyres (though admittedly i\'m not sure what your running now) which would probably see better and more practical gains?
Please don\'t for a second think i am \'hating\' here, because thats not what i am doing i\'m meerly giving you an opinion of what i\'d do in your position. I\'ve been given similar advice by members of this forum when i\'ve gone off and started to do things that are ultimately pointless.
:)
If the AFM is supposed to see 12V, I am not sure if the emanage could intercept that signal. Not sure if it will go to 12V or not for an analogue input / output.
Certainly the emanage ultimate does 5v analogs - but then almost all sensors work to a 5v reference anyway.
I guess you are between a rock and hard place on this, as the AFM is the only way the emanage blue can control the fuelling
its all just a learning experience really, as its all new for me :) upgraded exhaust system is on my list at some point, coilovers would be nice although ive got lowered springs if i even decide to fit them and tyres....cant remember if theyre a decent make..but theyve got tread lol
It\'d be nice to have this emb all running with the car and then atleast i\'ll know if it was pointless...im at the final hurdle again where i had to walk away because of the safc id like to finish now with the emb lol
Quote from: Prof;816513If the AFM is supposed to see 12V, I am not sure if the emanage could intercept that signal. Not sure if it will go to 12V or not for an analogue input / output.
Certainly the emanage ultimate does 5v analogs - but then almost all sensors work to a 5v reference anyway.
I guess you are between a rock and hard place on this, as the AFM is the only way the emanage blue can control the fuelling
i thought the emb had a bit more flexibilty and again isnt going to be a maximum of 5v...that\'ll be quite annoying heh
Quote from: Kamatari;816514its all just a learning experience really, as its all new for me :) upgraded exhaust system is on my list at some point, coilovers would be nice although ive got lowered springs if i even decide to fit them and tyres....cant remember if theyre a decent make..but theyve got tread lol
It\'d be nice to have this emb all running with the car and then atleast i\'ll know if it was pointless...im at the final hurdle again where i had to walk away because of the safc id like to finish now with the emb lol
Fair play to you, hope you get it sorted :Thumbs-up
If you have access to a multimeter, then connect the black lead to ground, and measure the output of the AFM on the 20V range.
If it is only a 5V AFM, then as you operate the flapper door, you\'ll see the voltage vary -You will need the car set to IGN, but not start. I thought the EGI\'s were still a 5V referenced AFM, but you will be able to verify with this test.
I don\'t think the emanage can output any analog voltage over 5V, so if you\'re AFM really is higher, then it won\'t work.
not sure if this will show up... from my search last year when with the SAFC... and a diagram page herehttp://rx7cz.net/pics/IMG_0663.JPG
EDIT: Whoops, well heres a link to the post then http://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php?p=10591389&postcount=43
Looks like it\'s wired to 12v but that passes through a resistor and then onto the divider / wiper that feeds the variable throttle signal to the ECU.
Bot the first divider point and the variable flapper take off are fed to the ECU - pins VC and VS respectively - which are pins 2B and 2E respectively on the ECU - measure 2B - it should be a static voltage - not varying with throttle - if that is close to 5v, then the flapper signal will be anywhere between 0-5V - so it may work ok with emanage.
Looking at the wiring diagram again...., ive tried pin 2b and 2e, but i it looks as if theres also 2j and 2c that i could take a reading from and see if anything works out
Infact after looking at it more, the wire to pin 2j seems to be going through a variable resistor so i think i need to start there,the wire going to pin 2c has gone through 2 resistors and before its got to pin 2c, it seems that a few things have come off it, one of them being the throttle sensor which i know reads a 5v when fully pressed which could also be promising?
Quote from: Prof;816533Looks like it\'s wired to 12v but that passes through a resistor and then onto the divider / wiper that feeds the variable throttle signal to the ECU.
Bot the first divider point and the variable flapper take off are fed to the ECU - pins VC and VS respectively - which are pins 2B and 2E respectively on the ECU - measure 2B - it should be a static voltage - not varying with throttle - if that is close to 5v, then the flapper signal will be anywhere between 0-5V - so it may work ok with emanage.
2b and 2e are what ive used originally and thats reading 1.5v when the car is not on, if i start the car (with no emb) then the reading ill get is about 7.5v but with the emb before it cuts out gives it a max reading of something like 4.85v
Anything over 5v on the AFM\'s variable input into the ECU and you won\'t be able to use the blue emanage to manipulate that signal - doesn\'t stop you using it for for other signals, just means it can\'t control the AFM.
Not sure how much fuel adjustment you could get without using the AFM, but you could use throttle position / RPM / MAP to adjust the fuelling still.
i will check later on tonight on pin 2j which is probably the pin i should have been using all this time instead of the others which i was told due to it actually being a variable resistor that its passed through! (means my safc probably would have worked LOL) fingers crossed and all that...
i dont think pin 2c will work as i reckon thats just going to be a fixed voltage so i "pin" my hopes and dreams on 2j
I reckon 2J is input air temp sensor - just a thermistor attached to ground - so it\'s not going to give you any air flow information. Greddy manual says 2B - but that doesn\'t look right either ??
but wouldnt it use the intake air temp sensor which is 2L for that?
starting up and then cutting out pretty quick does sound like it could be AFM related tbh. I\'d be surprised if the AFM worked on anything other than 0-5v, so the EMB should be able to read that signal ok.
I\'d have another look at the wiring and make sure you\'re tapping into the correct wires, also make sure the electrical connections to your AFM are secure.
Is this problem only since you installed the Emanage? if you remove the EMB from the loop then does the car run fine as stock? (ie just using the OEM ECU).
Worth checking that the jumper settings on the Emanage unit are correct for your model & year, and that you\'ve got the right airflow meter and other settings selected on the drop-down menu\'s.
I\'ve used EMB on other cars, but never on an RX7, for a naturally aspirated engine you could probably increase the Mpg slightly by trimming fuel where it\'s not needed, and also advance the ignition to make some power gains, but generally the few Bhp you do manage to free up does not work out particularly cost effective in my experience.
Also, I wouldn\'t seriously attempt tuning the maps without a wideband O2 sensor and some det cans/knock detector, you could rough tune it and get the rest dialled in on a dyno though.
yeah it works fine without the emb connected but when this is connected (or the safc neo at the time) it would just start up and cut out, going by the wiring supplied and the settings it is right, trying it on wires that have been suggested in the past its had the same issue but measuring the voltage comes in at 7.5v without the device attached and running normal which is the problem, i\'ll check the two other wires that i think could be better to use and see what voltage they read and if it looks in the right range then i\'ll attempt it with that
right well with the car wired up to 2j i can start the car, with the real time monitor recording, the air flow input the emb is getting is 0v and it is outputting 0.13v so i must be on the wrong wire there :( although i must say it idles a bit nicer i feel lol...
so pin 2j for the variable resistor is looking like a no...
Now the other issue ive got is that the rpms doesnt match up, when its idling its reading about 3k and then increase throttle and it goes up but is always about 2k - 3k out...
Well reading into it more, with 2j being the variable resistor its voltage should be 1-4v so wrong wire or not, i feel like something is wrong with the signal from the variable resistor seeing as my input voltage is only reading 0v and if its outputting 0.13 its getting it closer to what it should be lol
Quote from: Prof;816551I reckon 2J is input air temp sensor - just a thermistor attached to ground - so it\'s not going to give you any air flow information. Greddy manual says 2B - but that doesn\'t look right either ??
I think you are right on this now and it is a thermistor lol so just 2c left then
So the fsm says the air flow meter voltage should be 1.5v I believe when car is set to on, when you open the flap fully wide it will read 7.5v. I\'ve tried a spare air flow meter and gives the same reading, the only wire it gets this reading is the same as what\'s recommended in the greddy manual so am I going to be out of luck?
It does look like you won\'t be able to use the AFM as an input/output on the emanage - as it\'s out of the 5V range for part of the flapper swing.
You can still monitor throttle position, RPM and other items that will not go outside the range.
Well I\'ve tried different settings, the input wire will show 7v when flap is open but emb maxes out at 5v, so output is only 5v and hence the problem, guess its time to get rid :(