Mazda Rotary Club

So I bought the car for 300 and myself and rotorheid decided too attempt too start it today after it has been last driven end of 2001 it turns out

I say attempt as it refused too but so far after draining file and oil etc and replacing with fresh stuff we have definitely got fuel too the rail although it is coming out of the return pipe a bit quickly as far as I can tell

The ignition side of things seem ok with plenty of spark and we have already cleaned the plugs rotor arm and dizzy cap

So any ideas here are a few pictures for now after we spent sone time digging the car out

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/cfd0e773.jpg)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/65e47d45.jpg)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/b68d0f9a.jpg)

Also a quick pic of rotorheid(Ian) doing his thing and smiling for the camera
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/bd021637.jpg)

Wonderful find, however... underneath all those RC planes how on earth DID you find her?! :)

A bit of luck as his son drove past my house spotted my fc3s and told me about it

And the fun begins, I\'m sure you\'ll figure it out, good find.

Yes but the big question is why any ideas folks

We think it may be the air flow meter flap stuck closed

Are you thinking of selling this on afterwards?... ;)

Lol its missing its battery cover :rollin

No I\'ll be keeping the car for myself and using it daily

Mitch it must be the only thing that\'s missing from the car every other little trim handbook and tool kit etc is there I\'m gutted it didn\'t start but Im sure it will as it sounds like it has plenty compression etc

Quote from: the hat;807363No I\'ll be keeping the car for myself and using it daily

Mitch it must be the only thing that\'s missing from the car every other little trim handbook and tool kit etc is there I\'m gutted it didn\'t start but Im sure it will as it sounds like it has plenty compression etc

Its just funny how hardly any have the battery cover, this EGI has been sitting in a barn for aaages and has still somehow managed to lose it battery cover :rolleyes:

Nice find though :D

ace another rotary owner in aberdeen!

Nice find. Hope you can get it going without too much trouble. Keep the updates and pic\'s coming.

Ade

my rx7 still has a battery cover :O does it make it a r@re car :p

Nice little find though :) hope you manage to get things sorted out

I managed to buy a battery cover... Heh heh heh

You could try taking the AFM off and just moving the flapper door back and forward gently to free it up a little.
 
I\'d be tempted to take the plugs out and maybe even change them - it took a little while to get Lacey\'s running after it had been flooded, I reckon if you\'ve tried to start this one it\'s probably flooded a little too - but it will go.
 
Good find :cheers

No it\'s not flooded that\'s my problem prof the plugs have been removed before the first attempt and cleaned but we removed them and there still bone dry

And as for another rotary owner I\'ve been on the go for a while wolfie

Fire some "Start yer :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored:" or Eze Start into the inlet - if its got a proper spark it will go...

I\'ve always been taught while working in garages that easy start is pretty bad for your engine but yeah I think I\'ll give it ago and fingers crossed with some of that stuff it will soon fire up

It\'s not ok for regular use - but it\'s epic for getting a moddy rex going :)

I\'ve already got a moody fc rift car that generally annoys te public lol so this will get slammed with 17x9et10 wheels and an exhaust and air filter probably fit a decent seat and steering wheel and that will be it finished

Quote from: Brett;807426It\'s not ok for regular use - but it\'s epic for getting a moddy rex going :)

Aren\'t all FC\'s moody :Giggle

So OK ...

1 - are you getting fuel into the engine
2 - are ALL the plugs firing

start with the basics and then we can all have a think as to why it wont run :D

They have fuel going around the fuel system - from previous post - so if it\'s not getting fuel then it can only be injectors -  but is it mechanical or eletrical ?
 
Might worth checking that injectos are getting Positive feed via EGI fuse / Main relay, and that ECU Injector outputs are being momentarily grounded as the engine turns over (at least on the primary injectors).
 
You can do a \'click\' test on the injectors by unplugging the ECU and momentarily grounding out the Injector signals - the corresponding injector should \'click\' audibly.
 
You\'d have to take them out of the rails to test they were actually flowing.  
 
NOTE - I think the EGI injectors were low impedance, so have series resistors - don\'t be tempted to flash the injector terminals with 12v directly - you may well cook the injector coil if you do !

i did read it Prof , but it read as fuel was coming from the return pipe ( have to admit , i dont know a lot about the fuel system ;) )

so what does the green jumper do in the engine bay ( prime ) , i assume this just applies 12v to the fuel pump and the injectors ?

i suppose another way to test for fuel ( not that i recommend it )

pull the plugs , keeps the leads out the way and crank it WITH the egi fuse in , i guess that it should mist fuel out of the plug holes ?

Quote from: grinder;807483i did read it Prof , but it read as fuel was coming from the return pipe ( have to admit , i dont know a lot about the fuel system ;) )
 
so what does the green jumper do in the engine bay ( prime ) , i assume this just applies 12v to the fuel pump and the injectors ?
 
i suppose another way to test for fuel ( not that i recommend it )
 
pull the plugs , keeps the leads out the way and crank it WITH the egi fuse in , i guess that it should mist fuel out of the plug holes ?

It does exactly that - but best to take the plugs out of the leads and keep them away from the chassis too - don\'t want any stray sparks :flamed

you certainly dont !! ... that could cause rather a large mess

I\'ve had the plugs back out and tested for spark yesterday and there is definitely a good spark but they came out bone dry so it\'s definitely a case of injectors not firing

I\'m going back too the car for an hour or so tonight so fingers crossed I can get it going

Any quick ideas before I head over

i would be tempted to remove plugs, move leads , jumper the green connector and see if you can get fuel into the housings

Where is the connector and which terminals do I jump  as it runs on easy start but the injectors are still not firing fuel in

errrrrr i think its down by a coil at the front near the headlights

i would google it though to make sure you jumper the right one

Here\'s a couple of things you can try:
 
The jumper connector - on my car it\'s yellow, but could be green - it\'s by the drivers side shock tower on a T2 - not sure about EGI, but when you short it out, the pump will run when the ignition key is turned to IGN (not cranking).
 
The Injectors take there feed from the EGI fuse, via the main relay, so when the ignition is on, the injector wires at the ECU will nominally be 12V - the primary injectors are on 3C and 3E which are on the top row of the smalles connector - of the 3 wires in the centre, one is always grounded, so the other 2 are the ones you want :
 
3I 3G 3E 3C 3A
 
3J 3H 3F 3D 3B
 
The one other thing that might be killing the fuel - there is a fuel cut off switch in the AirFlow Meter - designed to cut fuel if the car turns over - make sure the connector is properly plugged in and the wiring isn\'t damaged or the connnector contacts dirty.

Taken from : http://www.1300cc.com/howto/how2/rewire.htm

Time to test it.  Get a jumper wire and jumper the fuel pump check
connector - it\'s a yellow two-prong connector on the passenger\'s side shock tower
in the engine bay.  It might be buried a bit, so keep looking.  After
jumping the connector, turn the key to "On" (don\'t start it) and go back to the
hatch.  You should hear the fuel pump running.  If not, check your wiring for good
connections.


Just bear in mind , this could be for a USA spec car !

you beat me to it Prof ;)

Right I\'ve checked the air flow meter and I e checked the terminals at the ecu and I have 12v at the terminals you describe

Fuel pump also works fine I\'m starting too think the ecu might be dead

you will get all sorts of dash warning lights and silly clicking noises if it is

although when mine went in the TII , it would crank fine , fire fuel thru , spark fine , it just wouldnt actually run

take off the ecu , open it up and see what it looks like on the inside

i wish i had checked mine first on the cab , as i spent weeks trying to fix it - and i could have spent 10 mins swapping a ECU

Hmm ok well does anyone have a spare egi ecu I can try just too see I\'ll easily pay the postage

There is an egi being broken in the for sale section if not?

I might have one in the loft at my parents if you are willing to wait until the weekedn for me to go find it?

Brett that would be great if you did also the local guy rotorheid has sent me a text saying he will check and see if he still has one

Also I am presuming the ecu gets it\'s timing signal from the dizzy so if anyone has a dizzy lying around I could try that would be great

Well unfortunately Ian does not have an ecu but does have a dizzy sonic still looking for an ecu too try and other thoughts as too why it won\'t run

did you say you are getting voltage at the injectors? if you are then surely it wont be the ecu? dont know a sausage about 2nd gens but just giving a different point of view. the ecu controls the injectors does it not?
 
i would personally think that if the plugs are bone dry then the injectors are full of crap and rust from being sat for 11 years?
 
sometimes the easist fix can be the last thing you would think it would be.
 
this is me assuming that the car actually has fuel injection? and not being carb\'d?

it might be worth trying to tow start the car too? just like when you have a rebuild the engine is tight. might just need that extra little bit of kick to release anything that stuck in the engine?

Yes the car has fuel injection but I would prefer to know what voltage they run between so I can test manually and I also need too know which injectors are the ones it uses too start ie idling etc

Is it the upper pair easy too get too or the pair on the lower half pain in the arse

It has crossed my mind that they might be blocked up but hopefully testing them
Manually will show this

My resins for the dizzy are that when cranking the rev conter jumps about alot making me think that te signal too the ecu isn\'t great

Also as for tow starting it\'s nit possible as the suspension is in bits hence a squirt of easy start too try that theory

Cmon folks I need some help I know I\'ll get There in the end but I\'m sure the more knowledgeable folks will make it run sooner than me on my own

I\'m gonna go with blocked injectors too. If the plugs are dry and there is power at the injectors then its deffo where I would start.

Ade

I\'m not sure if there is power at the injectors though the upper pair certainly don\'t have any power at them when cranking but the ecu is getting power at the injector pins that prof mentioned I\'ll work it out tho

Is that Redex stuff no good? Can you find a way to get some of that into the inctors for a few hours?

can you not pull the injectors plug them into the rail and turn it over and see if they squirt?

i should have a spare ecu still i can find out

Cheers the ecu would be great as it just rules that out hopefully tonight I will have checked the injectors too see if there blocked and tried the dizzy as mr and Ian are heading back over too the car in a little while

Ok so tonight we achieved nothing but we did find that the injectors are not blocked by manually opening them one at a time and the cAr attempts too start when doing so

So I looked inside the ecu but nothing looks damaged
 (http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/c2f7c864.jpg)

Then I attempted too check for power at the tps but found nothing ???
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/e01e2f9c.jpg)

I also opened the main relay and everything was fine inside and working as it should

Someone please help me I\'m ready too do this now
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/b0183d69.jpg)

Excuse my simpleness, but its not like something daft like a flat battery is it?

bad earth somewhere ?

is the ECU seeing the full 12v ?

Not sure how the TPS works , but does that get feed a direct 12v feed , or looped thru the ECU ?

Have you checked all the fuses in the engine bay ( with a meter not just visually )

I know it sounds really silly , if you remove the ecu and try and start the car .. does it do EXACTLY the same thing as its doing now ?

I\'ve not tried starting with the ecu disconnected and I don\'t know the pin outs for te ecu sadly

And no I just visually checked every fuse in the car and under the bonnet and checked too see there is power getting too the fuses I\'ll replace the lot of them next time and see what happens

As for bad earths I added extra earths by using a set of jump leads with one connected too the engine and one from the body straight too the battery negative terminal

And no not a flat battery unfortunately

Hope the last pic gave someone a laugh

i have the pin outs of the ecu somewhere ( might be in the factory manual )

let me nosey ;)

not sure if this helps

i have loads of stuff on the egi .. but no idea whats relevant and what isnt :(

and its 80mb in PDF\'s

I might bebale to zip it up and get it to you somehow ??

was it a lighter or a water pistol?

Gas powered air gun fella funny thing is I just found it and joked about only too finfmd it was loaded and working eek lol

The TPS has 12v, 5v, and a ground. Tell me the colours on your TPS and I will be able to tell you which ones which.

M sounds like there are some power feeds gone wrong so I\'m generally really looking for a ecu I can try in and also a idiot proof pin out for the ecu

i suppose one basic thing to check , is the ECU getting a full 12v feed ?

The diagram
Of the pinouts when it says looking at ecu how would you describe it if that makes sense

you should beable to tell from the shape of the plugs

but i THINK they might be the pins on teh ECU not the wires ...

check the plugs and see if the look the same :)

Hmm I\'m away too check the old instructions for an safc2 and avcr see if it works out any better as the diagram from apex you have there shows a power wire where the is no wires too my ecu

not sure where that came from , it was used when i was pluggin in a A/F Guage

It\'s alive I\'ve tried uploading a video too photobucket but it keeps failing so now I need too rebuild the suspension and replace the fuel pipes

Mitch hurry up with sorting the postage for the exhaust it\'s far

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/b2b39cc4.mp4)

Well pics tell a thousand words but after getting it too start the garage was smoked out lol

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/e3415b92.jpg)

Then after a bit of more cleaning up in the shed the car has enough room too walk around and give me space too get te suspension back on and the car has exactly 51000 miles on it

Woop woop

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/43da818b.jpg)

Good work. So what was the problem in the end?

Good news! (especially as I forgot to go and look for my spare ECU)

:D

Tiddles I have no idea after checking all earths and lives I found nothing wrong and got fed up so just kept trying too start it and eventually it stRted too offer then boom it was alive so happy so so happy need suspensions and brakes and away we go too the mot man

Also I need that exhaust an rx7 should never EVER be that quiet lol

You beat it into submission ;)
 
Nice work - hope it\'s all good for the MOT :)
 
Another one saved from a life of idle rotting away....

No its not all good e en being stored inside for 11 years has left it needi g fuel
Pipes and a patch of welding but otherwise once the brakes and suspension are back on I can\'t see it being too difficult too get a pass

Once motd the fun can start tho

Really glad you\'ve got her running, as Prof says its great that another has been saved from the scrap yard.

I don\'t think this would have ended up at the scrap yard it would just have been left for another 11 years or so lol

^^^ thats prob just as bad

its a great feeling when you get one running right that hasnt done for years

congrats on all the hard work

Right so on Sunday I ripped the rear calipers of te old White fc for this

Then my braided fuel line arrived so I could make new fuel pipes not much pictures of this as I couldnt be arsed crawling underneath again
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/4a133bd1.jpg)


Then I set about the rear hubs and brakes basically all the hubs and brakes were stripped from the car before I got it so the rear discs after 11 years looked like this

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/83cf2ce5.jpg)



So I chucked om on the lathe at work



So then after reaseem ling the rare hub on the drivers side and fitting a calipers and disc etc it all started too look complete again although I\'m still waiting on my lowering springs before I chuck the shocks back on



Then I dove into the car fired it up flukes the heaters on and made some braaaaaaaaps



Gotta love the buzzer when it hits the redline

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/106d1d86.jpg)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/de7da33f.jpg)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/f2d9ab8f.jpg)

I\'ve no idea why these photos never showed up first time round

Interested in a set of FTO GPX rims? Tyres are shot but could be good as a spare set?

(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l49/m1tch_2006/CIMG0810.jpg)

Ha ha sorry mitch my select reads

Standard 200 wheels x8
Standard soarer wheels x4
R32 gtr wheels x4
Standard egi wheels x4
17x9 advan sa3r x6
17x8advan sa3r x2
Veilside Andrews 17x9 x2
Works rezax 17x9 x2
Work equips 17x9 x2
Work equips 17x8 x4
Winners a31 17x9 x4
Legarra ?? 17x8.5 x4
Buddy club p1 16x8 x2
Advan sa3r 16x8 x2
Super advans 17x8 x4

So I don\'t think I need any fto wheels sorry fella

Your an official wheel whore :Giggle

Ha ha there\'s a couple of sets mssing from that list

Here is a pic of what I usually take too drift events

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/0ce74573.jpg)

What a beige Capri? or am I missing something!

Mk2 escort rs 2000

niiiice, should of brought the mk2 to the north west rally event last weekend :]

and any of those wheels for sale by any chance??

The escort is fr from mot mouthy it will get there eventually tho it\'s not mine either it\'s my good pals (Marcus)

Sorry buddy I\'ll be keeping them
All for now although I might sell some of the 16s as they don\'t clear my rear brake conversion well some of them don\'t

Nice save of this mk2, hope the project all goes well!

Good work bud... So chuffed for you!!!

So was at the car again this evening but unfortunatkey I never got anywhere near as much work done as I\'d hoped mostly due too the immobiliser being a dick again so took the plunge and this is the results are

Hat 1 immobiliser 0

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/d6fca80f.jpg)

Then I decided too have a look at the rear shocks as the spring on the drivers side was broken and I had some Nissan stuff kicking about I set about the bodgery and now have some r33 gtst tein type hr front shocks and springs fitted too the rear end although I know it\'s gonna be really stiff which doesn\'t bother me I have a feeling I may have too remove a coil as although there about 50mm shorter in length when sat side by side the suspension isn\'t really gonna move with the weight down on it

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/820f0a8d.jpg)

Then I started on the front but lost interest mostly as I\'m shattered from working from 7-7:30 then straight too the car untill 22:00 but the new front ball joints and track rod ends are now fitted

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/c7b34805.jpg)

I\'ve also decided I\'m gonna either fit 17x9 et10 veilside Andrews on the rear and 17x9 et25 advan sa3r  on the front but I hate mismatched wheels so I might fit my 17x8/9 work equips painted satin black too match the spoiler and door mouldings etc

tasty, good work.

i always wondered about the nissan shockes for the rear, now you have answered my question

Yeah I had too trim the clip that would normally hold the front flexible hose as it hit the standard backboxes

Only a few jobs left as I was at the car again today so I gave the inner arches a good coat of stonechip and then I gave the inner arches a good coat of black chip resistant paint

The front driver side suspension and brakes are all Rebuilt but I still
Need front brake flexible hoses ad make up the short brake pipe that goes between the flexible hose and the caliper

Only jobs left are too rebuild the passenger front suspension and brakes fit a new
Master cylinder and bleed the brakes fit new wipers and a couple of bulbs

I also need too fit a new alternator belt then it\'s go time

Ok so im so close too having this finished it\'s scary all I need is 1x front flexible hose

I set about it again today and replaced the viscous fan

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/b33c6e12.jpg)

Then I needed a new alt belt so I wiped off my dual pulley and it\'s belts from my old fc and swapped it over but I\'m still running the air pump

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/f4e79ccd.jpg)

Then it was time too finish fitting all the suspension and brakes minus the above mentioned hose I also had too make new short pipe sections for between the calipers and hoses

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/3a0a1396.jpg)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/b8ff6123.jpg)

Then I fitted a blank to the brake pipe where tree was a hose missing and decided too rebuild the master cylinder as it has been weeping out the back and over the servo it was very simple all I needed too replace was two o rings

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/6be53cc9.jpg)

Then I bled the brakes that are connected so far and let the rear down and tbh I think the ride height is perfect I just need some coilovers for the front or find some other option that will work

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/e154565c.jpg)

Also I love the reg honestly I think it might be too much of a coincidence

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x278/thehat1984/ed0c32fe.jpg)

you are getting on well there!

i would would nissan s13 front suspension work if you changed the top mounts over?

go on... be the guinea pig, i mean experimentor!

thats great work fair play to ya

Dnt worry I will be the ginuea pig unless I find some coilovers for the front Oh wait I just got a full set of apex coilovers for an s14 for free so I guess it\'s time too
Make the fronts work lol

Good man!lol

Yeah I\'ll have an answer as too if yet work on monday night buddy