morning all,
just sold some Impreza lights on eBay, item number 220774886183
transcript follows;
him;
Hi mate. I\'ve just received your lights thanks. But only to find out when fitting them that they are for an import car not uk. Which wasnt mentioned in description. Are u willing to refund all costs Inc. Postage to return these lights?
me;
Are you sure they don\'t fit? They were taken off a UK car, so there shouldn\'t be a problem.
him;
Yeah, positive mate. There isn\'t a fog light, and depending on where you put some bulbs. You can either have red indicators with normal reverse lights or orange indicators with red reverse lights. Which won\'t pass English mot.
me;
They are definitely off a UK car, the photos show exactly what lenses are there, I don\'t know about Imprezas so I can\'t help you with what bulbs go where.
The photos clearly show the lenses both sides, the option to request more photos and to ask questions was there.
I\'m sorry to say it, but the advert also states no returns, you could fit a seperate rear foglight but the reverse and indicator lights I can\'t help with.
him;
Ok, just gonna go through resolution centre now
me;
That\'s up to you, but there was nothing wrong with my advert, I wasn\'t trying to fool you in any way, the item was accurately described to the best of my knowledge, there was the option of communication if you weren\'t sure of the item you were buying as well as more photos.
I\'m sorry the item was not what you expected but they are exactly as described in my advert.
Transcript ends
where do I stand on this?
You\'re not exactly in the wrong as far as I\'m aware, they came off a UK car so it\'s not your fault they don\'t fit another UK car, he should have asked for more information if they didn\'t look right or looked different to what he has, asked what exact impreza they came off of, actually bothered to look into it, rather than bidding blindly and then complaining, I always research anything before I fork out money on it to save myself trouble.
Take how much info I was trying to get on the gearstick bushes before I even looked for somewhere that sold them for example. Not your fault he rushed in and bought it without using his brain.
in your advert you clearly stated no returns , so you will be ok i sell alot of stuff on ebay and you always get ebay timewasters :Hammer,
the only thing you have to watch for if he goes through paypal they have there own resolution process , but as long as you stated no returns everything is ok.
any more problems contact me and i will arrange a sas team helicopters and locate him and take him out like bin laden lol:evillaugh:evillaugh
Presuming you had a photo up, is there any difference to the photo? Im guessing not, so just maintain they are the same items in the photo which he obviously looked at!
they are definitely the same item in the photos and the advert says no returns.
this is the advert;
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220774886183&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
i think you are fine mate but as 787b says, you may run into problems with paypal as they are very much \'buyer orientated\' when dealing with problems.
however just make sure you keep reiterating the fact that your item was perfectly described on your listing. He was the one who bought incorrectly, perhaps for the wrong year or something.
I think its more a case that he can\'t get his wiring sorted out, apparently, they ARE an import, from the US, but they still fit, the only difference is that the bulbs etc are different, again, a little bit of research would have shown these lights are only from the US, therefore the lights would be different.
Hid problem then!
He is probably trying to threaten you with "the resolution centre".
Let him do it and state clearly they are the same as in the photo and are accurately described!
Though in fairness your advert does say plug and play, not \'you will need to rewire and replace bulbs to use this on UK roads\'
I\'m with your buyer mate, you should have made it clear if the lights were for a US car if selling on eBay.co.uk
nope, they are still plug and play, all the bulbs were there (had to buy another 2 because 2 were missing) they still fit on the same wiring loom plugs as the UK one.
a bulb is a bulb... there is no difference?
however if they are left hand drive ones they are illegal ... but im guessing they\'re not so :s
Like I said, I gave as much info as I knew, I don\'t know Imprezas, they came off a UK car they worked fine on that car, I think he\'s just throwing a hissy fit because he doesn\'t like them.
I know you guys would not probably appreciate what I am going to say, but before I say it, can you please don\'t take it in the wrong way. I am just sharing :)
Had it been 400pounds worth of a transaction, I would have understood the stress you were having to go through!! But its 41 pounds..Its still a money, but think from a normal worker\'s perspective, for example, in order to defend your claim, you would have to spend around 5 to 7 hours (writing replies, etc etc) and ..if you multiply, 7 by 6.05 pounds (basic wage, i think), I think, it would cost you more than what you have earned out of selling those lights.
Is it really worth it? Off course, if you are standing up for a right cause then, money does not make a difference, but at the moment money and the suggestions of the other person is stressing you right?
So, coming to your case,
The fact in issue are,
1. The product,
2. The Price,
3. The Seller,the Buyer and the Description.
Starting with the first one,
The Product:
According to the British Law, Any product sold in the UK, must clearly state its made in Country. If you shop at any well-known shops like, Next, M&S, etc, it would 100% state where the shirt was made in .... Check this out on your attires..
So was the expectation of mentioning "made in" of the lights was reasonable or not??
I leave people to say yes or no.
The Price:
It was a used product, so putting it up on ebay and then selling it for 41 pounds in all circumstances suggest that it was a reasonable price as if you would have sold them new, the lights would have cost way more than that!
The Description:
You mentioned, its for 2001 to 2003 model and further said, and I quote, "plug and play".
Now, is the description defective?
I am afraid, my answer is Yes (Please I am not causing any offence). What the law says about that? The law states that the goods must comply with its description, sample etc etc, I can give you the Legal section if you want. Therefore, if its plug and play, they it must be plug and play on all Subru Impreza 01 to 03 model, there shouldn\'t be if or but i.e. Import and UK models.
If there is a difference in UK and Imported Imprezas and you were aware about it, then it is clear that, the weight was on you to mention that it was from the Import Car or the lights were imported from America. But, lets suppose, if you never knew yourself, which is not likely as deduced from your post, then the defense of innocent mistake can be entertained and you would be allowed to rescind the contract.
I don\'t know, what conclusion the Paypal would reach, but in all fairness you have a case of 40-60.. 40 in your favour and 60 in the favour of other party.
I can type so many other factors, but, then the legal language will come in it and the whole post will become unattractive for you.
Sorry mate, if I upset you in any shape or form...I may be completely wrong and paypal may decide in your favour. But, its a club forum so I thought I can share what I am thinking about the case.
Syed
What I gathered from Skiffys posts is that he didn\'t know about the lights being from an import until the buyer complained and he checked with the owner of the car they came from? So when listing Skifffy was under the impression that it was from a UK car?
Quote from: Lacey;761036What I gathered from Skiffys posts is that he didn\'t know about the lights being from an import until the buyer complained and he checked with the owner of the car they came from? So when listing Skifffy was under the impression that it was from a UK car?
Lacey, I appreciate your suggestion but (please again, dont get me wrong) is that a good excuse? If he had mentioned in the post that "Selling this product on behalf of the Seller, Or I am not aware about the product at all and the product will be sold as seen, Don\'t get me wrong "Skiffy :)" had a very good and strong defence (thou not a complete defence). Unfortunately the Advert was very vague and Skiffy never used the power of dsiclaimer at all...
Its the disclaimer which is going against Skiffy, otherwise, there is not any case to answer.
Sorry mate, I don\'t know you, but calling you Skiffy, I hope you dont mind that...If you do, I am sorry again :)
Syed
Well if u ask me, which I suppose technically u did, saying plug and play isn\'t really the point.
Check out what ur buying as a purchaser and make sure it is what u need. :2Rolleyes Surely the seller can\'t be held responsible for the buyer buying the wrong thing, especially when the seller has stated u can\'t return it!
Don\'t think u\'ve mis-sold it by saying plug and play cause I reckon they will indeed just plug in and work if u, as the purchaser, have the right car! Dunno if I\'m missing the point...wouldn\'t be the first time! :)
I would be stunned if you don\'t have to refund the buyer, paypal almost always go with the buyer. The fact that it doesn\'t have a fog light makes it not plug and play.
Phil
yep as above, 99.9% certain Ebay will side with the buyer and yes it sucks even when trying to give as much info as possible on the listing, pics, etc. Also afaik the \'no returns accepted\' is just so you can opt out of returns being accepted when the buyer changes their mind. Its not a get out clause if the item isn\'t up to scratch. Hence why buyers rarely state they changed their mind even when it may be the case.
Paypal and eBay almost always side with the buyer. However you shouldn\'t have to pay the postage for the items to be returned to you. My understanding is that paypal will ask him to return the item to you and will refund him when you confirm receiving it OR the tracking number he provides paypal confirms YOU have received it. Note the caps on YOU. I\'ve seen many a case where a persons father/wife/son etc (even with the same surname) signs for said item and paypal don\'t pay because it\'s not signed for by the person whose account it is! All in all, the eBay and paypal resolution service is a joke and why I will never use their corrupt payment system or stupid auction site!
whats the point of saying no returns in your add?, a buyer can always return an item regardless. you may as well offer a returns policy. ebay think 70% of people think its important to a buyer.
thats what ive found. the buyer can always say something get their refund. If they need to.
I have no idea how someone can buy something with two clear photos and then complain, if you cant work out from two photos they arent the lights for you i am surprised that the time wasting fool even knows how to operate a computer.
Just to add a similar story, i had a mate sell a 325i (old shape) on ebay, the buyer came some 200 miles, looked over the car, handed over the cash, then drove it all the way back and then phoned up to complain about the condition! and he wanted his money back!