There has always been a shudder on the clutch on all my RX7s when caught in traffic, but this one has started to shudder quite badly when pulling away after only a short time, having been layed up for along time so I\'m putting down to that, any idears or is it time for a new one as there is no slipping when pulling away just the shudder.
I\'ve never had a clutch go on me in a RX7 so I\'m not sure what to look for.
Dibs
Sounds like either the clutch plate is warped or you have some oil contaminating it....usual causes of clutch judder. Worn engine or gearbox mounts won\'t help either.
Cheers Ian I\'ll chk them out,
Dibs
I read years ago that oil contamination can be helped by doing what proper drivers don\'t do; that is to drop from 4th or 5th straight into 2nd at some sort of useful miles per hour and lift the clutch to spin the plates against each other, (i.e. don\'t pick up the engine revs). You know - the sort of clutch screaming that inexperienced drivers get.
That can help to clean the plates but don\'t do it too much obviously.
Seized propshaft uj will also give similar symptoms.
Keith...
Thanks gents, if I do have to get a new clutch, any idears where to get one from, as the only places I can find on the net are in the US.
Dibs
I\'d have thought Clive would be a safe bet...
Quote from: A7RXY;701777Thanks gents, if I do have to get a new clutch, any idears where to get one from, as the only places I can find on the net are in the US.
Dibs
Dibs, did you manage to source clutch? If notthere\'s a guy asvertising on ebay - melville4663 (he has 2 available), Item No. 280461217225. Hope this helps. Cliff
Cliff thats great, the guy is just up the road from me I will ring him.
A friend of mine has a Mr Clutch and I was talking to him about it, and he said it could be the flywheel because it only happens when it gets hot, but he will not look at cars this old because they are to much trouble, and he is a good friend and wants to remain one ............
Dibs
Great news, they will fit and reface the flywheel for £350 +parts, going to see the guy on Sat.
Thanks Cliff good spot ..............
Dibs
They might be a lot of trouble but they are worth it, after all nothing else comes close to driving 1st Gens. Cliff
ps the attachment is not mine but isn\'t it gorguous!:god
I\' ve got a set of 4 wheels for a series 2, I paid £10 each for them, when I was at a breakers a while back, so if you are ever down south again and fancy them let me know.
Dibs
Quote from: A7RXY;707229Great news, they will fit and reface the flywheel for £350 +parts, going to see the guy on Sat.
Thanks Cliff good spot ..............
Dibs
Do they know the flywheel is held on by the \'FB\' nut.....54mm? Or will they reface from under the car? To remove the flywheel is a real pain unless you\'re used to doing it. (I\'ve only removed one.....finally used a series of chain drillings to split the nut).
They have said that they have done a few in the past, but I will mention it on Sat.
Thanks Dave
Dibs
Quote from: A7RXY;707232I\' ve got a set of 4 wheels for a series 2, I paid £10 each for them, when I was at a breakers a while back, so if you are ever down south again and fancy them let me know.
Dibs
It\'s a pleasure to help out - good offer, will bare this in mind. Cliff:cheers
Quote from: David Nock;707250Do they know the flywheel is held on by the \'FB\' nut.....54mm? Or will they reface from under the car? To remove the flywheel is a real pain unless you\'re used to doing it. (I\'ve only removed one.....finally used a series of chain drillings to split the nut).
So the vehicle model is based upon the size of its\' nut....... hmmm :3Confused. Wonder what the size is for the \'FC\' model? Perhaps the bigger the engine size the bigger the nut or could it be the bigger the nut driving? Have to think about that one.Anyhow, had no experience of removing flywheels so cannot comment other than soundz like a job for the experienced/competent person and idiots like me who prefer to do the job so can tell others not to bother or the easy way to do it is.......Cliff
its 54mm on FDs and RX8s too. I\'m pretty sure its the standard for all rotaries. Resurfacing the flywheel would require it off the car...it needs re balancing as well if your having any machine work done to it.
When I worked as a Shift Engineer in Pilks Glassworks, St Helens, some 40 mumblemumble years ago, one machine had the \'FB\' nut on top of the main ram. It was an American Lynch Corporation Glass Press, (come over to England on lend lease I\'d say!). So all the fitters would say \'not the FB nut to loosen again!; fetch the six foot Stillsons and three more men lad\'. (For a lad indeed I was.....once).
Same sentiment with the rotary engine Flywheel nut.
Most cars (Pre dual mass flywheels) used to have a ring of bolts which could be undone fairly easily and the flywheel then came away from its crankshaft mounting. Not the rotary, it\'s a taper fit flywheel on the end of the eccentric shaft with the single aforementioned \'FB\' nut. Bloodxy murder it is, that\'s with the engine out of the car.
Thanks boys now you are getting me worried ...................
Dibs,
how certain are you of this diagnosis?
Obviously, I haven\'t seen your car and I don\'t know exactly what the symptoms are but I can say that in 22 years of thrashing the b******S off these things, I\'ve never bent a flywheel.
It seems like a lot of money to spend for what may only be a clutch plate.
May be worth getting a 2nd opinion from somewhere knowledgable about 1st gens like WGT before you commit yourself.
Ian, I\'m buying the clutch from the guy on ebay as it is only £47, I think its because it had not been used for such a long time that the clutch is playing, what the guy has said is that untill they take the gearbox out they will not know what the problem is. It started to play up on the way back from Brooklands, its ok when you start off but as soon as its warmed up it shudders when pulling away from rest. the price he quoted was for fitting the new clutch and if the flywheel need refacing that would be included. I\'m not in the position to remove the box myself, and £350 did not seen to bad a price.
This is the company and they appear to know what they are doing.
www.specialisedengines (http://www.%3cb%3especialisedengines%3c/b%3E).co.uk/index.htm
Check that clutch out carefully before you order it Dibs because that description sounds a bit off to me.
The clutches weren\'t all the same from 1978 to 1988 and they changed from series 1&2 to the series 3.
series 3 clutches were larger (225mm) where as the series 1&2 were 215mm.
I think the centre splines were different as well and if this is the case, the input shaft on your gearbox won\'t fit the smaller clutch.
Check out this thread...
http://mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64716
He does say its 215mm in the add, when I go to see him on Sat I\'ll check it out, I\'ll let you know. The only other clutch I\'ve found was over £200 just for the assembly.
I know they are a pig to get out if you haven\'t got the proper puller but while the box is out try and replace the spigot bearing as this could be the source of your judder where the first motion shaft isn\'t supported properly due to spigot bearing wear.
Thanks Clive I\'ll take that on board.
Dibs
Here you go, this may help
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MAZDA-RX2-RX3-RX4-RX5-RX7-ROTORY-CAPELLA-SAVANNA-CLUTCH-/220636252471?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item335ef20937
Thanks Clive, but thats a 215 dia plate, and as I understand it the series 3 uses a 225 dia plate. Here in lies the problem.
Dibs
I think this is the one you need if you can find a similar one in the UK at the right price...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1983-1989-Mazda-RX-7-Exedy-Clutch-Kit-/390222093034?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5adb0c9aea
.
Thanks Ian,Thats the same make as the one I\'ve found in the Uk, but at £225,
I\'ll check it again tomorrow as the details are no my office comp.
Ian this is the one I found in the UK. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/EXEDY-CLUTCH-MAZDA-RX-7-2-3-V210-83-85-/390175566954?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item5ad846ac6a
I will email the guy in the USA to ask how much for shipping.
Cheers
Dibs
Quote from: A7RXY;707356Thanks boys now you are getting me worried ...................
Don\'t be worried Dibs, As Ian, The Flywheel is very unlikely indeed to be worn, overheated or warped.
Also as Ian (Bloodxy double act going on here), I\'m sure the S3 clutch plate is 225mm. I measured an old one of mine for someone on here not long ago.
Problem should be in the clutch itself but as Clive, pay attention to auxiliary parts while the clutch is out. Plus you need to be sure the gearbox front oil seal is sound whilst the box is on the floor. I woke up in the night with a further thought about this problemo......plate sticking on the gearbox splines? Why splines should occur to me in the night I can\'t think.
Find the right clutch somewhere and any competent garage can do the change.....it\'s all older technology if you discount having to take the flywheel off. At a quick glance, Ian\'s link looks dead right.
Thanks Dave, I,ve been intouch with Exedy about the clutch and they have told me the kit for the series 3 is MZK 2017, I can get one through Eurocarparts at £201+vat,
But I\'m now looking in getting one from the US. Watch this space.
Morning Dibs, didn\'t realise that Eurocarparts did RX7 spares/parts - will contact my local agent for more details. Cheers, Cliff
Ian, Just ordered that clutch from the States, with shipping it still only came out at $150:95, the same clutch in the uk was £220+ ($300).
Why do they always seem to take the p1ss out of us in the UK\'
Rant over ............... lets just hope it arrives.
that\'s a good price I reckon.
Yes I\'m happy with that, as the gearbox has to come out then the least I do is change the clutch.
Quote from: clive;707390I know they are a pig to get out if you haven\'t got the proper puller but while the box is out try and replace the spigot bearing as this could be the source of your judder where the first motion shaft isn\'t supported properly due to spigot bearing wear.
Clive are the pilot and spigot bearings the same ?
Yes, fairly sure so. Pilot bearing because it goes into a blind hole in the flywheel which \'pilots\' the alignment of the splined shaft. Spigot bearing because it acts on the splined shaft spigot. Different terms for same bearing.
That\'s my view....hope Clive agrees.
Thanks David, thats what I thourght.
I think its an American term, they always seem to have different names for things.
Its like when they named the Ford Probe, thinking of say a space probe, as we over here think of a probe you stick up your ar.................
The clutch turned up yesterday, so thats 11 days from the states now thats what I call a good service, now just got to get it fitted.
But needless to say the taxman and post office had to have their bit, £26 vat and handling fee, now thats taking the p1ss ....................
that\'s still a bargain Dibs, I think you\'d be hard pushed to get one that cheap over here.
That place is well worth bearing in mind.
Did you have the full kit in the end?
Yes Ian including the bearings, I have emailed the Guy in the US to say thanks, and even he was suprised at the speed.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1983-1989-Mazda-RX-7-Exedy-Clutch-Kit-/390222093034?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5adb0c9aea
Dibs, did you get this clutch fitted? ...... was it ok?
Not yet still trying to find someone I can trust to do it.