Hi all, there are a lot of threads on here about big single turbos for big power. Is there a single turbo that will effectively replace the stock FD twins almost like for like on power and delivery or is this simply not possible with a single i.e will low down torque always suffer? I’m thinking about my twins being pretty old now and the sequential setup being less than reliable, I’m not after any big power increase just want simple reliable power?
Just go for a GT35r setup. The low down grunt won\'t be as much but you should see around twin turbo power for very little boost. Will spool quickly on a smaller A/R and be very reliable.
I\'m running a GT3574 that is a plain bearing and it doesn\'t have the initial kick of the twins but the grunt a little further up makes up for it ! Plus I get more then stock and the power delivery is so smooth !
Shaun
T04e is a good turbo for the street, very quick spool up and gives you a kick when it comes in... good response like the twins and you can get to 400fwhp whilst maintaining reliabilty
Ok thanks for the suggestions I\'ll have a look at those, I like the idea of the smooth power delivery although still not sure about loosing the low down torque. Are these turbos OK on a relatively stock engine with PFC assuming keeping the boost down?
Yup, T04e should be a great bet - sub 400, but super quick spool :) You cna pick them up cheeeeeeap too.
Oh look, I\'ve got a T04E manifold for sale as well :D
I\'ve got a GT35R in mine and it was mapped by Carl Hayward. I can\'t remember what it was like with twins to be honest, but the boost builds so quickly I don\'t think you\'ll find it a problem.
Even at .8 bar of boost it is rapid enough for me at the moment.
TO4Z ftw as its a good all round turbo alternative would be a GT35r
size order of turbos so far
t04e--------gt35r-----------t04z
but some are ball bearing and some plane. if you have a search around there is a lot of info on all the above tubs.
for my money t04e or a plane bearing gt35 as bb type are expensive to rebuild and t04z is way too big.
Matt
Make sure you get a journal bearing turbo, not a ball bearing one, the ball bearing ones won\'t last that long with the crazy heat of the rx7 exhuast.
Quote from: m1tch;676044Make sure you get a journal bearing turbo, not a ball bearing one, the ball bearing ones won\'t last that long with the crazy heat of the rx7 exhuast.
Tehre are people running ball bearing tub\'s for many a mile on RX7\'s - look at the popularity of 35r\'s, T04z\'s etc around the world.
I\'m interested in this also, would the GT35R be more laggy on an unported engine ?
Tempted with the T04E at the moment as I am just aiming to remove a lot of stuff from the enginebay and to run it as reliably as possible.
GT35r will be a bit laggy on stock ports, but not too bad - a decent port will improve that no end though :)
T04e should be a corker on stock ports - if i hadn\'t rebuilt and seen the chance to port, I\'d have done that in a heartbeat :)
In fact, that was why I went for the HKS cast mani - cheap, efficient, bombproof, and perfect for a small single :)
If it\'s of any interest, I\'ve got an HKS wastegate I may be tempted to sell as well, so all you\'d need was turbo, lines, and WG.
If it was me and I was starting with a stock setup I would go for the T04e (although there are lots of variations) as this will not need every thing else to be upgraded, ie fuel clutch ect. Then at a later date as/when more power is required it is simply a matter of upgrading the ancillaries as necessary and bolting a larger turbo on.
Matt
Thanks for all the responses, sounds like the T04e is the one to go for. Anyone have any ballpark figures on what one of these would cost fitted?
Chris
Well, as a rough guide, SH manifold £200, SH wg £150ish, turbo £600ish new, £300ish SH, lines etc £100 maybe? Exhaust downpipe fab £100-£200, then a few bits of silicone to sort out your IC piping :)
To4e will be lagger than the gt35r unless you run a 0.96 rear AR..
GT35rs arent expensive at all to rebuild - i would say they are on par with a bush bearing turbo rebuild.. Its just the rip off vendors of the UK that think they are alot more expensive when they arent!
Rebuilt my GT35r with new bearings, seal kit and rear wheel for $400.
To4Es spool extremely fast, I usually see boost at 1400rpms and full by 2500. I have attached a photo of one of our systems
T4 Gt35Rs response very nicely too with a fair bit more top end; I have also attached a recent dyno sheet.
To4e will be lagger than the gt35r unless you run a 0.96 rear AR..
Are you tripping??? how can a T04e be leggier than a gt35r? The GT35 is a far bigger turbo and BB do not make that much difference
GT35rs aren\'t expensive at all to rebuild - i would say they are on par with a bush bearing turbo rebuild.. Its just the rip off vendors of the UK that think they are alot more expensive when they aren\'t!
funny even in America it is expensive (over $1000 just for the CHRA) and as i understand it the bearings are not a user replaceable part.
Rebuilt my GT35r with new bearings, seal kit and rear wheel for $400.and it was built and balanced by who? The only thing I have seen is that Garrett are replacing the CHRA and wheels as long as the CHRA and 1 wheel is still serviceable.
I\'m not trying to cause trouble but if you are going to give people advice you should make sure your facts are correct.
To get this thread back on track, Chr1s are you planing on doing the conversion yourself or taking it to a shop? If its going to be done by a shop you should have a chat with them as I\'m sure they will have more experience than myself. Also have you considered the other costs such as ECU and possibly an uprated IC or WI?
HTH
Matt
Quote from: arrouk;676427I\'m not trying to cause trouble but if you are going to give people advice you should make sure your facts are correct.
:god well said matt
you beat me to it
imho go for the t04e, good little single and drives very similar to twins
t04r or tdo6 will be the next step up
Quote from: arrouk;676427To4e will be lagger than the gt35r unless you run a 0.96 rear AR..
Are you tripping??? how can a T04e be leggier than a gt35r? The GT35 is a far bigger turbo and BB do not make that much difference
GT35rs aren\'t expensive at all to rebuild - i would say they are on par with a bush bearing turbo rebuild.. Its just the rip off vendors of the UK that think they are alot more expensive when they aren\'t!
funny even in America it is expensive (over $1000 just for the CHRA) and as i understand it the bearings are not a user replaceable part.
Rebuilt my GT35r with new bearings, seal kit and rear wheel for $400.and it was built and balanced by who? The only thing I have seen is that Garrett are replacing the CHRA and wheels as long as the CHRA and 1 wheel is still serviceable.
I\'m not trying to cause trouble but if you are going to give people advice you should make sure your facts are correct.
To get this thread back on track, Chr1s are you planing on doing the conversion yourself or taking it to a shop? If its going to be done by a shop you should have a chat with them as I\'m sure they will have more experience than myself. Also have you considered the other costs such as ECU and possibly an uprated IC or WI?
HTH
Matt
Well back in australia were rotaries are built propoerly!!
Most to4e\'s are either 1.15 or 1.32 AR.. If you ran a 1.32 rear on a stock up opened engine yes it would be lagger than a 1.06 T3 foot print Gt35r..
I dont give a .... what you say as ive had both on a car and the 35r was on song alot earlier than the to4e.GT35r comp wheel if i remember is 60mm vs standard to4e of 57mm which is minimal.
My turbo was rebuilt bu Honeywell Garrett in sydney for your information and sorry for posting as im no longer a groupy so i know nothing :)
I haven\'t seen a need to go past 1.15 turbine a/r on a To4E. EMBP is really low even at 20+psi where they start to run out of air( with or w/o pre compressor injection)
Quote from: arrouk;676427To get this thread back on track, Chr1s are you planing on doing the conversion yourself or taking it to a shop? If its going to be done by a shop you should have a chat with them as I\'m sure they will have more experience than myself. Also have you considered the other costs such as ECU and possibly an uprated IC or WI?
HTH
Matt
Hi Matt, will probably get someone else to do it tbh, I know my way round the engine bay but don\'t know much about turbos as you probably guessed by the thread! I agree next step is to have a chat with them about it, the T04e does sound tempting. I already have a PFC, uprated clutch and SMIC so hopefully wont need too much else.
Chris
Depends on your intended power levels are. You will want a bigger fuel pump regardless. I would recommend bigger secondary injectors too. Which SMIC do you have? They don\'t work too well, but adding water injection can take care of that as long as you\'re under 15psi.
Turblown, not looking for big power just reliability and simplicity, don\'t know what make the SMIC is just that it all aluminium, different to the standard one but more or less the same size. Will go over what needs replacing with whoever I get to fit it.
On my old setup I had a T04e running 1 bar with the standard 550cc Primaries and 800cc Secondaries, an uprated fuel pump, fuel pressure regulator and it was fine. I dynoed at 335rwhp @ 0.9bar
Quote from: chr1s;676773Turblown, not looking for big power just reliability and simplicity, don\'t know what make the SMIC is just that it all aluminium, different to the standard one but more or less the same size. Will go over what needs replacing with whoever I get to fit it.
I have run that setup before and never liked what I saw for intake temps, even with 50/50 water alcohol injection. Then again I am not familiar with your climate temps, if its never above 70 deg F ambient it will probably be fine. Lower the air temps the more reliable the car will be.
My car is running a GT35R turbo with a custom ceramic coated down pipe, manifold and polished compressor housing and have a tial 44mm wastegate re-routed to downpipe. Car is making 356 HP at 0.8 bar of boost. Very happy with it.
35r should be capable of a fair bit mroe than that dude - what fuel system are you running? I\'m in the process of putting one on and I\'m hoping for comfortably over 400.
Quote from: SiH;67824535r should be capable of a fair bit mroe than that dude - what fuel system are you running? I\'m in the process of putting one on and I\'m hoping for comfortably over 400.
I know it is capable of more, but the previous owner just wanted a very very safe set up. I am running a HKS fuel pump. :yes
I have a to4r with a .81 or .84 hotside and it spools more than well enough for me