Hi everyone, I just wanted to ask everyones opinon on what I should do with my IC setup when I change to the T88.
I am thinking of getting a flat mounted intercooler - the turbo outlet will point down, goes into the intercooler, then goes up past where the PS pump would be and in giving a nice short route.
This will then allow me to have maximum radiator exposure on the front for cooling along with the HUGE FC oil cooler.
I have been thinking I might change this for a large front mount instead now, but need some opinions if it would be ok.
Basically in my FC engine bay there are a few issues that get in the way of a good pipe pathway - critical to reduce lag.
The first is the mechanical power stearing pump, HUGE pulley, lots of pipe etc etc, I will be changing this for the saxo electric PS pump which will go down near to the stearing rack.
Another issue is the Oil cooler which is like a huge bar heater with hot oil in it, which also blocks part of the radiator - this isnt good either!
There is also a HUGE Viscous fan in the way - this will be changed to an electric fan :)
Now, here is my idea, I am thinking of getting a FMIC which will sit in front of the rad, the turbo will be pointing down again and feeds into the bottom of the IC, at the top of the IC there will be a pipe coming from that in basically a straight path to the compression tube and throttle body - might change for an FD compression tube to allow for the better curve into the TB.
I was then thinking about the oil cooler, I have just come up with the idea of flat mounting them like the IC would have been on the base of the engine bay, this will allow maximum cooling at the front as its not blocking anything, and also allows airflow through them that might have been blocked with the FMIC pipework although I might still be able to mount them where the OEM foglights go but have a twin oil cooler. Because the electric power stearing pump will be down there as well, there is probably very little space for a large enough IC to fit as a flat mount, but an oil cooler is smaller and should be ok :)
I know everyone will say \'get a V mount\' but I don\'t want a V mount as Liam has a V mount and I want to be different lol
Would this FMIC work? I have tried to think of a route that would allow the straightest path and also the shortest and still allowing for nothing that is cooling too near something that is hot.
how about this.
Run that large oil cooler where the standard intercooler goes so when on the move it has a nice cool intake, this would get it out of the way of your intercooler and rad.
Its pretty popular on big power imprezas because if you have a intake, you may aswell make use of it.
Then i would go for a 3inch intercooler, something off ebay would be fine, you could mod a fake greddy kit but since you dont run oil coolers in the same place as an fd i would look at something like this.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/UNIVERSAL-FRONT-MOUNTED-INTERCOOLER-3-76MM-BAR-PLATE_W0QQitemZ130322654492QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item1e57d5e51c
the piping would look something like this
http://www.rx7club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=372449&d=1263259731
only with silcone 90* instead of backdooring the cooler which you could if you liked.
the other option is the have the intercooler inside the engine bay.
This might be useful for you if your drifting because if you wack your bumper you wont damage your cooler aswell.
you could go for a 70mm thick rs500 cooler in the engine bay with a ali rad right behind it.
the rad would sit a little lower than the cooler so theres room for the pipes but that would give you the shortest pipework you could get
like this
http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs072.snc3/13935_220979026656_643856656_3672588_7477812_n.jpg
but we need to know how much room you have between your headlights to work out whether that would fit.
im only throwing random ideas out, anything close?
what about re-a uim? as i think u will be going be going 500bhp.
Quote from: L18M;674857what about re-a uim? as i think u will be going be going 500bhp.
It will produce 450 on stock ports at 0.9 bar, so me thinks it might be lol although the 850bhp+ FC was running OEM FC runners :)
I do like the idea of a top mounted oil cooler! Very cool idea, the only issue being that with a front mount I would need a rear facing bonnet for the correct air flow, unless I just cut louvers in my OEM bonnet :)
i wouldnt think you would need a different bonnet as it works on an fd with a stock bonnet.
the air would go beneath the car and down the transmission tunnel wouldnt it?
if you can measure the this distance we can probably work out what will fit
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/8178/84paintedenginebay.jpg
Quote from: turbotoaster;674883i wouldnt think you would need a different bonnet as it works on an fd with a stock bonnet.
the air would go beneath the car and down the transmission tunnel wouldnt it?
if you can measure the this distance we can probably work out what will fit
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/8178/84paintedenginebay.jpg
Can\'t see that image there is an issue, with a FMIC you need to have the correct bonnet, needs to flow from high pressure to low pressure and then get out somewhere lol
well i would imagine if the vent on the bonnet was covered then you wouldnt have a high pressure area being created at the back of your engine bay, maybe then run the intercooler in the bumper then as it seems to work even with a bonnet scoop as i would imagine the air hitting the intercooler will be higher than the air that has entered your engine bay and worked itself around to the front of the engine.
like i said the scooby guys all run front mounts with bonnet scoops and seem to be fine.
the picture was the distance in your engine bay between your chassis rails.
You could run a V on it\'s side - would need custom intercooler and rad - but rad could site on the drivers side at the front, and intercooler on the passenger side.
Air paths could still be fairly short with this - the V of the mount would be dead centre to the front of the car
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Oil cooler could be mounted in the nose, at the bottom or top of the V, or on top of the engine. It would be different - haven\'t seen it done on an FC.
move the radiator back on a simple frame
and mount the intercooler flat in front and above the radiator
- and the oil cooler moved down on its mounts ( then angled back for ground clearance )
making it below and in front of the radiator
( with a small divider between it and the radiator )
(http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/1179/ccf2402200900003.jpg) (http://img514.imageshack.us/i/ccf2402200900003.jpg/)
this is how i have mine , note short piping path,, and 3 inch entries on I/C
( 90 elbow silicon reduces from 3 inch to 2.5 )
2.5 pipes past the I/C pulley ,, air con deleted
(http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/832/pic0216924.th.jpg) (http://img4.imageshack.us/i/pic0216924.jpg/)
(http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/422/pic0216922.th.jpg) (http://img64.imageshack.us/i/pic0216922.jpg/)
(http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/3192/pic0216926.th.jpg) (http://img717.imageshack.us/i/pic0216926.jpg/)
(http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/8274/pic0216925.th.jpg) (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/pic0216925.jpg/)
this method retains the front support bar , has short pipes,, doesnt need a vented bonnet
( i/c heat exchanged air spills over top of the radiator , not through it )
and importantly gives individual paths for air through radiator , oil cooler or intercooler independent of each other
and oil cooler can fit on the stock cooler lines
( but will run 100% flat if custom oil cooler hoses )
it was easy to do,, involved fab of the frame and minor cutting away of the old side sheet metal at the old rad support
and fabrication my own sheet metal to replace as side panel diverters back to the new frame and new rad position
-- the stock rad was initially used and also fits to this frame,, and move back so that the bottom rad entry pipe nestled in the hump conveniently in the front sway bar
-- radiator top position is no lower than before
BTW,, works very well, very noticeable improvement in radiators ability to deal with heat soak quickly and also in the intercoolers touch temp after a long drive
( i believe the previous FMIC install was heatsoaking the intercooler with rad heat )
-- all in sunny western australia,, 42 Celsius as i type
- 13b six port, turbo rotors ,mild turbo centre plate, 0.6 V front highflow s5 turbo, LPG ( propane ) only
ohh i like - i take it you are running an elec fan aswell ??
be carefull of cheap ebay ic cores. they flow like Sh*t
c
its ok - i can see the elec fan on the pics :D
thats a really funky design, never seen anything like that before, does the air bounce off the rad and up to the intercooler, or just travel through once the high pressure has reached a certain point infront of the rad that it has to find somewhere else to travel, as i cant see how the cooler gets a direct path to fast moving air
Quote from: mx1311;674951be carefull of cheap ebay ic cores. they flow like Sh*t
c
I wouldn\'t even bother with ebay cores, they are basically just pipe with fins to block flow lol my current top mount is an ARC copy with a pace core, was built by someone called phil (it has its name on it)
I do like that semi V mount idea :D can I use the idea?
The problem being is that my radiator is MUCH MUCH bigger than that :( so might have to route pipes slightly wider :( but then again, I won\'t have an PS pulley in the way, what turbo is that btw?
Oh, I also need to ask this as well, but what bonnet are you running?
Quote from: turbotoaster;675030thats a really funky design, never seen anything like that before, does the air bounce off the rad and up to the intercooler, or just travel through once the high pressure has reached a certain point infront of the rad that it has to find somewhere else to travel, as i cant see how the cooler gets a direct path to fast moving air
the I/C is sealed either end with stick on foam cushion seal
so forms an area between the headlights that is isolated from the air in front of the radiator
- but linked to the engine compartment behind the radiator by the 20 mm or so between it and the bonnet
and so works on the principle that air building up in front of the radiator is pressurised,, and pressure acts in all directions
the top of the IC is linked to the engine compartment behind the radiator
where the pressure is the same as the rear of the radiator
( and hence there is pressure drop across either side of the I/C and radiator cores = flow )
similarly the bottom stock tray is removed and the oil cooler projects forwards as the bottom lip of the airbox
( that is effectively made up on three sides by oil cooler, I/C and rad , and on 2 other sides by sheet metal )
removing the bottom tray increases the open frontal area that feeds the box
( so its much more than the air just from between bumper and stone tray lip )
to boot, the flat mounted oil cooler has its exit surface ( bottom ) subject to fast moving right angled air
- thus forming a venturi and more of a pressure drop than what would normally be achieved while vertical
( the flat oil cooler idea was used by mazda sponsored racers for many years, data showing 10 C ( 18 F ) improvement over the vertical install in sa22 racers )
QuoteI do like that semi V mount idea can I use the idea?
The problem being is that my radiator is MUCH MUCH bigger than that so might have to route pipes slightly wider but then again, I won\'t have an PS pulley in the way, what turbo is that btw?
be my guest,, take what you need ,, leave what you don\'t
the stock FC radiator sits in exactly this position
( the radiator frame was in fact built for my previous FMIC with stock s4 FC radiator )
i have the radiator on the same angle as stock,, merely pushed back so far as to provide the minimum of clearance from front pulley to the fan
the bottom outlet of stock radiator will nestle in the bump that is in that corner of the sway bar
turbo is a home built special,,equiv to a stage 2 highflow s5 turbo
-not quite a t88 but takes my fuel system, to its max at 18 psi
i use a custom rear dump plate ( 76 mm exit moved towards the wastegate)
modded wastegate flap with trust adjustable wastegate can
with stock mazda /hitachi turbine wheel and shaft
knightsports s320 0.6 compressor cover
t04b V trim 8 bladed compressor wheel
( 56 x 70 mm , 48 pounds per minute )
bonnet is stock turbo bonnet, although i know of a recently installed system that is similar and using the NA bonnet AOK
thanks for the great description, thats a pretty new idea to me.
I has seen flat mounted intercoolers where the flow of air would be passed down underneath the car through a cutout in the undertray(bit like a traditional v mount but roles swapped and the cooler being horizontal instead of 30-40 degrees.
my new cooler arrived today and im trying to decided how im gonna mount it myself