As title really, is it possible to tell if a clutch is push type or pull type just by looking at it?
or anyone got any good links that explains all the different types of clutches:
stage 1, organic, stage 2 etc..
I\'ve not really looked into clutched before so kinda new to them.
cheers fella
As title really, is it possible to tell if a clutch is push type or pull type just by looking at it?
Yes, if you look at the picture with the ring in the middle this is where the release bearing litteraly clips into the ring and pulls toward the gear box and lifts the clamping plate inside the pressure plate to release the centre plate so drive is disengauged
This is what is described as a pull type clutch found in RX-7 FD\'s
If you now look at the next picture you will see the fingers that the release bearing pushes onto away from the gear box to disengauge the clutch centre plate ,
This is what is described as a push type clutch found in RX-7 FC\'s, FB\'s and RX-8\'s
anyone got any good links that explains all the different types of clutches:
stage 1, organic, stage 2 etc..
An organic clutch refers to the driven material used on the center plates surface which is what is known as Ferodo material which initially was the same material that was used on brake shoes,
Typically a Stage one clutch will have an organic plate used in conjunction with a pressure plate that has more clamping pressure to stop the center plate slipping when more power is employed over standard.
A Stage 2 will normally use the same higher clamping force pressure plate but with a sinthered metallic center plate which is a composite metalic material made of a mixture of copper, bronze and other metals bonded together to give a surface that will be more resistant to slipping and cope with more heat if it does slip,
These sinthered clutch center plates are also called "paddle" or "puck" clutch plates because of there appearance
Hope this helps
thanks clive! :Thumbsup!:Thumbsup!
very good read. interesting to see so much difference in surface area between the stage 1 and stage 2.
next question, are clutches quite interchangeable with other vehicles if the clutches are of the same type (push / pull). this is more for the fitments size? (ie headlights, H4 will fit any car with H4 fitting, is this similar to clutches or are clutches much more varied?)
sorry about the questions again, im sure this is a good read for many other people :)
Liam, don\'t ever worry about asking questions here on MRC as you should know we are fortunate in that we have many people only too willing to help
next question, are clutches quite interchangeable with other vehicles if the clutches are of the same type (push / pull). this is more for the fitments size?
Normally across the Rotary range the center plates are interchangeable however with the exception of 0S Giken who make an adapter to fit a push style clutch to an FD, pull type I do not know of any way of fitting one clutch to the other without using the corresponding gear box
Interestingly Mazda went back to an FC push type clutch for the RX-8 which suggests that there is no advantage from one type of clutch to the other.
Liam,
The \'Stage 1\' etc convention is a way of grouping clutch components that are supplied together to give an idea of the capability of the upgrade. They are somewhat arbitary.
The main things to be aware of with clutch capability:
Clamping force - this indicates how much grip the clutch is likely to give. It does depend on the friction material used in the clutch plate.
Clutch disc Material - there are a number of different materials that can make up a clutch disc - organic, organo-metalic, sintered metal, carbon, carbo-metalic
Number of sufaces - single discs give 2 mating surfaces - multiple discs have intermediate plates that provide additonal grip - they are locked in by pegs on the outer edge, so tend to give that classical rattle when disengaged.
Disk type - the actual clutch disc can be a disc or paddles - usually 3,4 6 or more evenly spaced around the diameter of where the disc would have been
Sprung/Unsprung - if you look at the centre of the disc clutch - it will either be solid or have springs - the springs are designed to reduce the \'shock\' when engaging the clutch - the unspruck clutch is not really a good choice for road going cars - but will have very quick lockup for racing.
I once found a really good site that explained all the different aspects of chosing clutch components.
As for interchangeability. The diameter and number of splines on the centre of the clutch disc where the gear box input shaft goes does vary between manufactures. There seem to be some common combinations - but be aware that even between RX7\'s there are at least 2 different setups not withstanding the push / pull difference between FD and FC.
The stock FC clutch is a pusher - and has 23 splines and a 240mm diameter - same as the FD (except they are pull type).
after bit more research, a few more questions.
given the clutch has 23 splines and is 240mm diameter, does that mean that if the front plate(?)(the plate/housing opposite side of the fly wheel) is changed from pull type to push type then that can be used ok on fc?
also moving on to flywheels, from the above, it seems the fc and fd flywheel are the same size with different car makers using different size flywheels?
would the number of splines differ on the flywheel for different car makes or size be different?
can clutch plate be quite easily be interchanged given it has 23 splines and 240mm diameter?
having taking a clutch apart and trying to find part numbers to see if it would fit my fc.
it seems from the ORC website that the clutch cover, pressure plate and disk are all interchangable. the differing parts are the hub and flywheel ASSY.
now i have a hub which is roughly 240mm and 23 splines so it should fit the fc. but no indication on the flywheel what car its for.
anyone know how different flywheels differ from each other?
i found out that skylines splines on the fly are further back from the hub (so looks like its deep dish) but what about diameters of the flywheel?
does this look like it would fit fc? given the hub is 240mm and has 23 splines.
(i cant find any info with the numbers on the clutch cover, though this is interchangable FL210, and pressure plate ORD409cc176, only found out its carbon and rated upto 400ps)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4063/4206896867_09923e806b_m.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2612/4207611642_6cb9db72dd_m.jpg)
Liam - with aftermarket flywheels, there is often a need to use different counterweight in the front cover - as the one in there is for the stock clutch.
I know the OS giken flywheel\'s come with their own counterbalance. It may end up being that although the clutch and flywheel will fit, there isn\'t a counterbalance for the FC.
Having said that, different clutches and pressure plates can work with the stock flywheel or another aftermarket flywheel that comes with it\'s own balance - so there is every chance some of the bits are usable.
If you know who made the flwheel - have a look on their site and see if they do one for the FC - you may be able to source the correct counterweight for it - as I am sure they only make set sizes and sell the relevant parts to make them fit several cars.
thanks dave,
its an orc item, series 409 carbon pro. thats all the info i can get off it.
looks good condition, even wear.
not sure how to measure how much life are left in carbon discs but from the groove to the top surface is like 1mm?
not sure how good that is for carbon discs.