hey guys went for mapping at wgt today, the set up is
front mount
double throttle removed
decat and 3" back
japspeed turbo elbow
viton check valves
and turbo simplification mod (vac hoses)
however when it came to mapping it wouldnt budge over 10 psi (i think it was 10 psi) pip was very busy today so we though it was best to take it back home and make the vac system factory again, as he wasnt familiar with the vac simplification mod,
however from the diagrams on rob robinette it shows nothing for the fpr, so i took a vac hose from the lim to it without going through the solanoid, i thought this could have been the problem when getting home and looking at the two diagrams togeather but then i spoke to pip on the phone and he said it shouldnt be a problem
i quite like the ida of the simplification as it makes it easier for a simple minded idiot like me to diagnose problems, but i think i am going to put the rats nest back in this weekend and try again when he has a spot free
does anyone have any ideas?
also seeing as i have removed the double throttle do i just leave the solanoid that controls it unplugged from the vac system?
:wiggle
Do you still have the stock pill in the vac system controlling boost levels ? You may want a profec B spec2 or similar boost controller.
The FPR doesn\'t run off a solenoid (as I remember) its just as boost rises the pressure rises too. Where have you plugged it in. There are a few lines that give a weak signal. Best matching the original standard diagram nipple.
Shaun
was just about to say, what is controlling the boost, i know nothing of the rats nest tbh and dont want to lol
if that isnt the problem, then im sure others who have done the mod will help out.
Yep as said abopve you need to check you still have the pills fitted, ( although Im sure even 10psi is unachievable if you have removed them)
Also the double throttle solenoid can just be blanked off, i just removed the sol supply hose and blanked it, no probs
i still have the origional hoses with the pills in down by the turbos, i am using the apexi to control the boost, the problem is the diagram showing the simplified setup uses a california setup so there is an extra nipple at the top of the lim,
its just very confusing to me, i am right in thinking the apexi pfc can control the boost to a certain point?
Not without the apexi boost control kit which is just an external boost solenoid.
You can up the boost on the commander to a point without the above but only by changing the boost duty cycle NOT the boost value as such.
Are you able to select between two boost settings on the commander, if so any ideas how.
cheers
Quote from: thomas_mk6;653491.....was best to take it back home and make the vac system factory again, as he wasnt familiar with the vac simplification mod,
:wiggle
Surely he didnt say that :2eek
ok then say i wanted to do to 0.85 bar of boost, which i know is fine on standard fuel system, is this possible with just the apexi ecu and commander? i thought it was
also when putting the rats nest back in, because i have removed the airpump, am i right in thinking i no longer need to plumb in solanoids B and C (on the hose diagram) for "relief 1" ans "switching"?
QuoteQuote:
Originally Posted by thomas_mk6
.....was best to take it back home and make the vac system factory again, as he wasnt familiar with the vac simplification mod,
Surely he didnt say that
I\'m sure he did. Pip is a busy guy, so if you turn up for a mapping session and have boost problems, he will tell you to book it in to sort the problem out on another day or sort it out yourself and re-book the mapping session.
I doubt he has time to d1ck around solving a "vac simplification" mod gone wrong when he has a boat load of other cars booked in to map on the same day.
ye he had another 3 cars to map after mine, and to be fair id rather have a go myself and try and learn something, any ideas on the solanoids guys?
Yep - that can be done as that\'s what mine is running - non-sequential mind...... ;)
Quote from: thomas_mk6;653595ok then say i wanted to do to 0.85 bar of boost, which i know is fine on standard fuel system, is this possible with just the apexi ecu and commander? i thought it was
thanks fli auto, my silicone vac hose just turned up so ill be having a bash after work tonight
right when i got back from work i ripped everything out and started from scratch, i followed the vac diagram and marked off every hose as i went along and i am 100% everything is in the right place, 2 of the solid hoses on my rats nest had snapped so i havnt used it, i have just used t pieces where i needed to, on this edited diagram i have made everything in clear isnt included in my setup because i have removed the airpump and double throttle, also mine isnt california spec so i dont have egr
after i finished i started her up and she idled fine, let her warm up and went round the block, decided to be a naught boy as i am only on a part map as pip only did the low speed stuff, boost pattern was perfect, no problem hitting 10 psi, but then again it did that before!
here is the diagram
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a245/adisonrock/vacuum_hose_diagram2.jpg)
the problem is, i dont wanna go back to wgt and have the same problem again, i cant afford to leave the car with pip to tinker with as i can just about afford another mapping session, i need some way of testing it is ok before i go back to have the map finished
any ideas guys?
If you are running with the stock pill you will only see 10psi. The boost pattern is 10-8-10psi on a stock setup with the pill. How long would it take to save up for a boost controller ? Well worth the money to get better control of the boost level.
Don\'t go for the Apexi add-on boost controller. Have a search at some of my early threads and there are some maps of it and the profec. The apexi add-on was terrible, just couldn\'t keep up with the boost levels. The stand alone apexi is supposed to be better but the profec is a very good bit of kit.
Was the last tune one for an apexi setup too ? He usually just charges by the hr (min 1 hr) for any more updates unless major.
Shaun
Wrong.............
Quote from: neil_jdmr;653567Not without the apexi boost control kit which is just an external boost solenoid.
You can up the boost on the commander to a point without the above but only by changing the boost duty cycle NOT the boost value as such.
it seems like every1 has different ideas to what is correct lol
i was under the impression that with the stock pill in place and no aftermarket boost controller the ecu could control the ammount of boost to a certain point? say to .8 bar if i wanted
is that not right?
You can certainly run higher than 0.8bar on a stock pfc without the boost controller upgrade i have a low setting of 0.85 and a high of 0.9bar on my pfc and i dont have any type of boost controller.
At 0.9 bar the pfc records between 0.88 and 0.91bar but injector\'s are maxxed and
at 0.85 the pfc records between 0.81 and 0.85bar with mid 80\'s injector duty
The deviation in boost pressures recorded comes from ambient temp\'s changing i.e in cold ass 2 degree temp i get a strong 0.9 but in the summer mid 20\'s i was getting 0.88bar all on the 0.9bar setting.
Again to change the max boost it is the duty cycle figure that has to be raised, i.e the amount of time the wastegate remains open (i think).
Someone more knowledgable about the pfc on twins needs to step in here but that was my take on it.
What i do know is, You DO NOT need a boost controller to control boost with a pfc, The pfc will do it for you but not as steadily as a standalone boost controller will.
the pfc can control boost to 0.85/0.9 bar without a controller, mine did when mine was running twins. also the rats nest simplification only removes the emmissions side of things, so it shouldnt have affected turbo control. from memeory however (i havent got the diagram infront of me) it doesnt have a line to the FPR (which you need) and one of the solenoids is back to front, which is really easy to miss if you dont stare at the diagram for ages! i think it is the charge relief solenoid (but could be wrong). if that is connected up wrong that might be an issue?
If I\'m wrong I\'ll hold my hand up. I didn\'t mess with the pfc boost function. I swapped to a boost controller early on because I went above 0.9bar.
Shaun
PFC can control boost as high as you want. Just not a good idea running high boost on stock twin turbo\'s.
Regards
Carl
Quote from: HaywardRotary;653946PFC can control boost as high as you want. Just not a good idea running high boost on stock twin turbo\'s.
Regards
Carl
hi carl, she is booked in for mot tomorrow and then i can tax it monday, should be up to you around the 25th (pay day!):3gears-rh