hi guys, first post so take it easy :Giggle. recently bought an \'89 egi n/a. now the problems.. it will start from cold perfectly but once its driven somewhere and parked up it refuses to start! also the car has a rough idle and what feels like a slight misfire but only at idle as it drives fine.(maybe a little jerky at very low rpms) now ive read a few threads on here and have tried fiddling with the idle screw and have read about the TPS possibly causing the problem? recently had to fit a new distributor as the bearing in the old one was shot.(not sure if this bares any significance) cheers for any help fellas.
it could be loads a things, i had a similar idle problems, but basicly get a list of things and work through them. im not sure what the n/a and the turbo have in common, but heres a few things
check the spark plugs, clean or dirty
check for a strong spark
try clamping the fuel feed and return lines see if this smooths out the idle(too rich/lean)
bac vavle(is it getting power, and operating.
tps sensor, check the resistance
check air flow meter
i spent days looking for the problem with my turbo, and it was the intake manifold, basicly the engine was eating it :o
should keep you busy for a while :)
rik
cheers rik, where abouts is the throttle position sensor located?
on the turbo 2 model its on the throttle body on the top of the engine, just behind the altenator. it should be obvious on the n/a :)
looks like this
http://www.fujitaengineeringusa.com/fc3s/15.jpg
rik
right the car will start from cold on the button and will also start fine if the car is warm and turned off and imeadiatley started again but will still refuse to start if left for an hour or so. could this be due to the ignition timing being slightly out?
well its a good sign that it starts from hot or cold
the hour or so bit - could be a leaking injector - a simple way to solve this is to put a fuel cut off switch and when you leave the car - just flick the fuel pump off
someone has recently started a topic about it - might be worth just looking thru the 2nd gen section :D
Would that stop a leaky injector though Stu? Surely it would still leak what was left in the line? Or is that not enough to flood the engine?
hummmmmmm im not 100% sure .. BUT what i used to do was
1 - park the car up - still idling
2 - flick the fuel cut off switch
3 - wait for the revs to flickers ( means that you are draining the lines )
4 - turn the car off
5 - when you come to start the car , turn it ON but dont start it
6 - the fuel pump will prime the lines
7 - then start it
i used this method on the TII - but i didnt have the switch - the immobilser cut the fuel pump - so i used to pull that whilst it was running - same theory - just a different method
Quote from: grinder;614931hummmmmmm im not 100% sure .. BUT what i used to do was
1 - park the car up - still idling
2 - flick the fuel cut off switch
3 - wait for the revs to flickers ( means that you are draining the lines )
4 - turn the car off
5 - when you come to start the car , turn it ON but dont start it
6 - the fuel pump will prime the lines
7 - then start it
although i didnt use this method - i used to carry locking pliers in the glove box , if it would start - i would clamp the fuel line in the engine bay and start it ( only uses the fuel it has ) - once it fires - jump out the car and remove pliers
the AA man showed me the trick as i had flooded it and had no idea what to do ( and it was about 1:30 in the morning in a pub car park !! )
id rather just fix it! :rollin
well there is always that - but i would try the above - just as its a cheaper option ( and easier than replacing the injector 0 rings or the actual injectors )
i have edited my above post so that it makes a bit more sense ( but your quote shows the orig message anyways )
Tricky one this as it does start from cold and hot ok. If it was always starting rough from hot then I might be concerned.
Is this a UK or JDM model?
Think the first thing is to try and eliminate if its electrical ie ignition which includes all the sensors etc or just fuelling of some sort.
Did this do this before the new distributer was fitted? It may be those little deivices on the sides of the distributer,they can be replaced and if I remember right a similar problem was experienced by another member on here. You cant miss them as they have the wires coming out of them. It may well be that when they are hot they are breaking down or even one of your coils? But as others have said before you must check or replace the basics first and then go from there. It will be better for the engine in the long run and at least it will discount a few things.
Remember that if you adjust the idle screw then you must adjust the TPS as well or at least check its still has one lit bulb during the test. (or similarly check the resistance)
it only had the starting issues after i replaced the dizzy, also could fuel pressure be a possible issue? as when i open the fuel filler cap it draws in ALOT of air..? cheers for the help guys
(its a uk model btw) right got a bit more info(and questions!) had a look at the spark plugs today (these were brand new 3 months ago and have done under 200 miles) they have been carbon fouled, more so on T1 and T2 and i also found a small blob of fuel on T2(could this reinforce the theory of the leaky injector?)
also as a side question how can i check the tps is working without swapping it for a new one!
Not being funny but I think you answered your own problem........"only had the starting issues after you replaced the dizzy".
I think you need to look at that before you delve into anything else. Those electrical contacts on the side of the dizzy are notorious for breaking down and will give you similar problems to what you are experiencing.
Quote from: pdtaylor18;615508Not being funny but I think you answered your own problem........"only had the starting issues after you replaced the dizzy".
I think you need to look at that before you delve into anything else. Those electrical contacts on the side of the dizzy are notorious for breaking down and will give you similar problems to what you are experiencing.
would you suggest using the contacts from the old dizzy? as i have tried a couple of differnt rotor arms and caps
http://www.mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56631
read this chap and it might well be whats wrong with yours. I would swop your old contacts over.
Quote from: pdtaylor18;615511http://www.mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56631
read this chap and it might well be whats wrong with yours. I would swop your old contacts over.
cheers for that pdtaylor, seems he had alot of similar issues. im guessing the dizzy pick ups are the small black boxes on the side?
Yes they are and you can change them over in minutes. I think they are interchangeable so can go on either side of the dizzy,change one at a time to see if it makes any difference as then you will know which one was at fault. It will also give you a known good spare for the future.
Quote from: pdtaylor18;615628Yes they are and you can change them over in minutes. I think they are interchangeable so can go on either side of the dizzy,change one at a time to see if it makes any difference as then you will know which one was at fault. It will also give you a known good spare for the future.
changed these but still no change. also noticed that the unit ive circled in red only works on occasion
(http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u261/shep306/100_0536-1.jpg)
Not sure on the EGI\'s but thats only a damper if thats what i think it is and will not play a part in the starting issues. Might be worth trying a swop of the coils,see if the problem will swop from Trailing to Leading, unfortunately in this case its very hard trying to see whats wrong,even ECU\'s can cause this so maybe check down there as well,at least take the plugs off and on again in case its a bad contact. All you can do is iliminate things as you go along. One good reason to have a garage full of spares......just for that occasion.
right ive think ive narrowed it down to a fueling problem, possible the fuel pump as it seems to be flooding the engine(when warm) but will start after a few short cranks of the enigine. think i should try installing a fuel cut off switch. where is the fuel pump located on the egi?
Its in the fuel tank on the FC. Think the wiring for it is on the inside of the car.
You can also create a switch from the fuel pump relay but to be honest not much difference,at least going to the rear you can hide all the wires inside the car.
If the pump is working fine at all times then I would say theres nothing wrong with it, maybe more on the controlling side of things. Most pumps either work or they dont, or in some cases they just die when you want the power.
Seems your problem is temp related but at least you are narrowing it down.
Quote from: pdtaylor18;616406You can also create a switch from the fuel pump relay but to be honest not much difference,at least going to the rear you can hide all the wires inside the car.
If the pump is working fine at all times then I would say theres nothing wrong with it, maybe more on the controlling side of things. Most pumps either work or they dont, or in some cases they just die when you want the power.
Seems your problem is temp related but at least you are narrowing it down.
yea see this is what i was thinking, my old man suggested a faulty pump but i feel it works or it doesnt.. but its definately a fuel/flooding related problem as when i try to start it when warm it STINKS of fuel :3Confused if i find the fuel hoses i may try clamping them.
Im having exactly a very similar problem with mine, it starts on the button from cold every time but not from hot if its been sat a while.
It seems that if ive been for a long drive and gotten the engine properly warm then its fine, but if its just a short journey then the problem rears its head.
I find that if i unplug the fuel pump wires from under the drivers side of the dash the engine will always clear itself of excess fuel and start then I quickley plug the pump back in before the engine cuts out and its fine.
I was thinking that maybye the cold start assist was at fault but after reading this thread im now thinking it could be a leaky injector seal. Ill keep you posted as to how i get on as it may help you with your fault.
Not too sure on this leaky injector bit though as generally once they start to leak they leak all the time. It does not cost much to replace them anyway. Without being the bearer of bad news the only other problem with a car starting from hot ......is a worn engine but there are also other options to iron out first.
A few ideas:
1) PRC valve - this chap cuts vacuum to the Fuel Pressure Regulator for about 30-50 seconds when the car is started warm. The idea is to increase fuel pressure briefly to stop petrol percolating in the hot fuel rail. It\'s controlled by the orange solenoid valve. Normally the FPR sees fuel pressure regulated by the manifold pressure (so vacuum on idle to lower pressure, and on a tubby II, boost to increase fuel pressure). Not sure if the EGI has this circuit or not - but if you unplug the orange solenoid and just tap on the gas a couple of times until the engine stabilizes when you start then that could be the problem.
2) Boost/vac leak - during cold start the throttle plates are open so a small leak won\'t affect starting that much, but when warm the plates are fully shut when you start the car, so a vac leak will easily kill the idle. Spray a little carb cleaner (carefully :flamed) around the intake pipes and upper to lower inlet manifold join - see if the revs pick up - if they do you\'ve a vac leak.
3) Leaky injector - you can cut fuel completely during cranking by pressing the accelerator to the floor when you start the car - this cuts fuel and prevents a leaky injector swamping the engine on start.
4) Timing - if the timing is out it can affect the car\'s running and idle, more noticeably the idle when hot, it can be erratic and prone to cutting out. You can check timing with a timing strobe and the marks on the front pulley. The first mark to the right hand side should line up with the little needle when the strobe is clamped on either of the leading front plug wire.
5) Dirty fuel filter / dirty air filter - both can affact running / idle and acceleration and the effect will be more pronounced on warm start.
6) Plugs - never hurts to give them a good clean and possibly swap in another set - don\'t use a brass brush to clean them !
If I think of anything else I\'ll post it up.
cheers for that prof, can you cut the fuel by flooring the accelerator before cranking? then let off when(if) it fires
Works when deflooding too, if it\'s not too badly flooded - as the fuel is cut and the throttle plates are wide open pushing all the fumes/air mix out of the exhaust - best to remove EGI fuse when doing this though ;)
But yes, if you release the throttle when it fires up you\'re good to go - although it may need \'catching\' once or twice before it stabilizes.
right just been trying it while its warm, ive found that if i give it 3 0r 4 short cranks without it firing on the 4th or 5th try it will fire with very low revs so i catch it with the accelerator
ok thanks to prof ive found that cutting the fuel by flooring the accelerator makes it start fine when warm. so can the flooding only be caused by a leaky injector?
It\'s got to be one of the most common problems on an EGI, so I\'d say it\'s the most likely. It could be a bad fuel pressure regulator that\'s letting too much pressure build - but far more likely the injector