Mazda Rotary Club

Cars by Model Type => 3rd generation RX-7's => Topic started by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 12:48:49 PM

Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 12:48:49 PM
Hi guys
 
As some of you will know i\'ve had my FD for nearly 18 months now, i\'m 24 and love booting her up (but i am very sensible about it) so touch wood not a single accident yet
 
As of that, i think its now about time to try getting a bit more from her,
 
Its a completly standard 1300cc twin turbo (Bar an induction kit)
 
I have no idea where to start and was wondering if some of the more experienced guys could give me som advice
 
Thanks alot guys
Mike
Title: More Power
Post by: Rzla on May 13, 2009, 01:01:17 PM
Depends how much power you are after?
That will help you decide if you should go single or stay on twins
Title: More Power
Post by: jackaleks on May 13, 2009, 01:04:27 PM
your first step really should be a new ECU. at the very least one of the \'pre-tuned\' ones like RE-A or Knightsports, that way you won\'t run the risk of detonation and a new engine.
 
also get some gauges if you don\'t have them already (water, oil, boost...)
Title: More Power
Post by: Ada7 on May 13, 2009, 01:12:42 PM
If you get an Apexi PFC with the commander then you\'ll have an ECU that can be remapped as and when you up grade bits. Plus the commander will give you the extra gauges as well.
Seeing as you\'ve got the induction already then look at the exhaust. Ditch the CAT and get a better down pipe and free flowing exhaust. Lose the air pump at the same time (blanking off the holes left). This should see you getting some easy extra horses and response from the engine :D

Adam
Title: More Power
Post by: rx7ben on May 13, 2009, 01:13:47 PM
I have a knightsports Ecu that came off my FD if you want it
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 03:06:18 PM
Quote from: rx7ben;607273I have a knightsports Ecu that came off my FD if you want it

Ok mate, how much would you want for that and what kind of bhp would i get from it?
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 03:07:14 PM
Quote from: Rzla;607268Depends how much power you are after?
That will help you decide if you should go single or stay on twins

ok i think i\'d be looking for about 400bhp max tbh
Title: More Power
Post by: lee mills on May 13, 2009, 03:09:08 PM
fly or wheel.
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 03:10:08 PM
Quote from: lee mills;607310fly or wheel.

sorry... whats the difference
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 03:12:04 PM
Quote from: Ada7;607272If you get an Apexi PFC with the commander then you\'ll have an ECU that can be remapped as and when you up grade bits. Plus the commander will give you the extra gauges as well.
Seeing as you\'ve got the induction already then look at the exhaust. Ditch the CAT and get a better down pipe and free flowing exhaust. Lose the air pump at the same time (blanking off the holes left). This should see you getting some easy extra horses and response from the engine :D
 
Adam

ok how much am i looking to spend on a Apexi PFC with the commander and remapping?
Title: More Power
Post by: lee mills on May 13, 2009, 03:15:31 PM
Quote from: mikemike180;607311sorry... whats the difference

about 18 %
like already said your first step is to get aftermarket ecu Apexi/motec etc.
probably new fuel rail/injectors, fuel pump/fpr and a remap should get you somewhere near.
Title: More Power
Post by: lee mills on May 13, 2009, 03:16:49 PM
also with more power your going tto need better cooling i.e uprated intercooler and rad.
Title: More Power
Post by: Ed_RX7 on May 13, 2009, 03:59:55 PM
if i were you i would stay away from any of the pre tuned ones as 1. you cant confirm what mods they have been mapped for and 2....they have probably been mapped for japanese fuel which is 100 RON...!
 
just not worth it if you engine is sweet!!!
Title: More Power
Post by: leon on May 13, 2009, 04:05:01 PM
Thats not 100% true, Knightsports will give you a list of what mods the ecu was modded for etc if you post a message up on their forum with its serial number :driving

But yes the 100+ ron and not knowing what the ecu was mapped for and how conservative it was can be a BIG issue. :eek:
Title: More Power
Post by: overboost on May 13, 2009, 04:21:33 PM
Quote from: leon;607332Thats not 100% true, Knightsports will give you a list of what mods the ecu was modded for etc if you post a message up on their forum with its serial number :driving
 
But yes the 100+ ron and not knowing what the ecu was mapped for and how conservative it was can be a BIG issue. :eek:
I used to run a MINES STAGE 1 ECU on my R32 GTR with AVCR.  Mapped for Japanese fuel as well but runs pretty sweet with V-POWER.
 
However RB26 is one tough engine and I won\'t try the same thing on a Rotary.
Title: More Power
Post by: peterwolds on May 13, 2009, 04:38:54 PM
Quote from: mikemike180;607311sorry... whats the difference

400 fly near enough 340 at the wheels
Title: More Power
Post by: Ed_RX7 on May 13, 2009, 04:39:59 PM
Quote from: overboost;607336However RB26 is one tough engine and I won\'t try the same thing on a Rotary.

exactly!!!:yes
Title: More Power
Post by: Ed_RX7 on May 13, 2009, 04:44:22 PM
Quote from: leon;607332Thats not 100% true, Knightsports will give you a list of what mods the ecu was modded for etc if you post a message up on their forum with its serial number :driving
 

 
cool didnt know that!
Title: More Power
Post by: overboost on May 13, 2009, 05:58:31 PM
Quote from: lee mills;607315about 18 %
like already said your first step is to get aftermarket ecu Apexi/motec etc.
probably new fuel rail/injectors, fuel pump/fpr and a remap should get you somewhere near.
Is it really worth it for the stock twin though? I am kind of on the same boat here. Intake and back box. Planning to get down pipe and mid pipe, map it and call it a day.
 
With injectors, fuel pump, intercooler and everything why not go all the way and get big single?
Title: More Power
Post by: lee mills on May 13, 2009, 06:08:55 PM
all depends what power you want really. if you want to stay on stock twins then probably not. although better cooling is always a good option no matter what you intend to do
Title: More Power
Post by: Jono FD3 on May 13, 2009, 07:35:54 PM
Apexi ecu
Full exhaust system from turbo(s) back  (need to go single to see safe 400bhp!)
injectors
Intercooler
Fuel pressure reg
uprated fuel pump

going with stock twins you could see 350bhp, but any more than that I think you will be replacing turbos on a regular basis, so it you want more, then a single turbo is the way forward!!
Then a remap for the ECU!!

Jono
Title: More Power
Post by: shaunwil on May 13, 2009, 08:13:38 PM
I saw 380hp at the flywheel (320 at the hubs) with:

Apexi PFC,
Tripple Core Front mount,
1300cc secondaries (with better pump),
Twin spark,
80mm Downpipe,
80mm mid pipe
Ziegen Backbox.
Electric Waterpump
C-West Front Bumper (Improves air intake).
Stronger Clutch.

This was with the Turbos tuned at 0.95bar. Only really swapped to the single when I started having boost issues that were caused by vac line issues.

Its all about cooling. I\'m still running a stock rad, although it has had a brazed top cap fitted before I bought it and its still doing ok. On the single I\'m also running water injection and much more fueling. Its not a big turbo though !

Shaun
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 13, 2009, 08:39:25 PM
Quote from: Jono FD3;607424Apexi ecu
Full exhaust system from turbo(s) back (need to go single to see safe 400bhp!)
injectors
Intercooler
Fuel pressure reg
uprated fuel pump
 
going with stock twins you could see 350bhp, but any more than that I think you will be replacing turbos on a regular basis, so it you want more, then a single turbo is the way forward!!
Then a remap for the ECU!!
 
Jono

OK mate thanks,
 
So how much do you think that would end up costing to change it to a single turbo?
Title: More Power
Post by: Jono FD3 on May 13, 2009, 09:47:59 PM
that is when the money comes in, as good turbos are not cheep, especialy if you buy new!! then you have to get a wastegate, exhaust manifold, down pipe, & the cheepest bit: air filter! then you have to custom make the pipes to the IC. so you would probably be looking a few grand :(

Jono
Title: More Power
Post by: chrisJDM on May 13, 2009, 09:53:28 PM
if you want more power you are gonna have to change the injectors, you cant really turn the boost up much without maxing out the stock injectors.

Like others have said Apexi Power FC is a must and one of the best mods you can do
Title: More Power
Post by: Timmy on May 13, 2009, 10:00:08 PM
the cost of going single from stock is probably closer to £5000.
i gotta agree you will almost certainly have to upgrade the fueling.
Title: More Power
Post by: chrisJDM on May 13, 2009, 10:22:26 PM
yes when you add it all up, going for a decent single setup is gonna cost quite a bit, i built mine up over time so everything was ready for it then when i went single bought one and just bolted it on, job done :)
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 14, 2009, 12:04:29 AM
Quote from: sweetiewells;607487if you want more power you are gonna have to change the injectors, you cant really turn the boost up much without maxing out the stock injectors.
 
Like others have said Apexi Power FC is a must and one of the best mods you can do

Ok mate, do you know any web sites i can pick one up?
Title: More Power
Post by: lee mills on May 14, 2009, 12:18:45 AM
probaby best to give one of the tuners a ring they might have one in stock if your lucky
Title: More Power
Post by: mikemike180 on May 14, 2009, 12:27:00 AM
Ok guys
 
I think at the minute i should stick with the twin turbo\'s and just try pushing as much as i can, i\'m still not sure exactly what i\'m needing in an apexi pfc, are they pretty standard?
Title: More Power
Post by: D7REU on May 14, 2009, 01:32:55 AM
The PFC will come with a base map for your car, however it will be best to get it mapped pretty quickly, as it runs pretty rich on the base map.
 
You can pick em up from Ebay/Tuners etc..
 
These guys have some new and used one\'s in stock most of the time:
 
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260394779820&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT
Title: More Power
Post by: shaunwil on May 14, 2009, 08:11:11 AM
Quote from: mikemike180;607529Ok guys
 
I think at the minute i should stick with the twin turbo\'s and just try pushing as much as i can, i\'m still not sure exactly what i\'m needing in an apexi pfc, are they pretty standard?

That\'s all that most people do. The majority of the mods done to build a single are done to build a better twin. The apexi, fueling & cooling are the first bits !

Shaun
Title: More Power
Post by: jackaleks on May 14, 2009, 09:00:32 AM
Quote from: mikemike180;607529Ok guys
 
I think at the minute i should stick with the twin turbo\'s and just try pushing as much as i can, i\'m still not sure exactly what i\'m needing in an apexi pfc, are they pretty standard?

 
they plug straight into the standard ecu loom (underneath the passenger footwell trim). the only reason i\'ve not bought one is because i\'m a bit short of cash!
 
it\'s a lot easier to lean out a rotary with basic mods than a piston engine and the consequences are a lot more serious. your average turbo four-pot can cope with detonation to a certain degree, on a rotary you\'re going to do damage. the apexi is the best way to adjust your air/fuel mix to stop this.