Was just wondering what sort of power/torque you can put through the standard gearbox before you start having trouble. When do most people start looking at upgrades?
Cheers,
N
generally at around 500bhp some will no doubt go earlier
depends how you treat it I reckon.
My 5th gear cog blew up with ~300rwhp, just quite why 5th gear went and not 1st or 2nd, I\'ll never know.
Thanks guys, long way to go before that problem but was interested to know ;)
Quote from: g11ary;508972generally at around 500bhp some will no doubt go earlier
Spot on.............:wiggle
So what\'s the upgrade route at the 500bhp mark, I will be hitting that will my new setup?
i currently use only stock gearbox setups in my car so far to date i make around the 550rwhpand they hold up fine the only time i break them is when im being silly and quick shifting at the sweet spot under load.
i am about to turn the wick up on my setup so should be around the 700hp mark i will still only use the standard gearbox\'s here are teh reasons why
1) at $450 australian dollars it is very cheap to change them
2) most gear sets like OS GIKEN gear sets are only recomended to hold around the 500 hp mark and are not all that much stronger
3) i did find out about a PPG dogbox for the car but at $12 000 australian dollars and no gaurantee that it will hold the power i cant chance that kind of risk as if it blew i think iwould have to throw the gearbox through their front window .
4) Hollinger are the only company that said yes mate you wont break our box\'s we run them on cars with alot more than yours ...so this is a great thing ...........also their box is a 6speed sequential box so that is even better ,,,,,,,heres teh bad thing coming in at $17 000 australina dollars that equates to what around 34 standard box\'s hmmmmmm
well i hope this has helped you out a little there is other option available to you like t56 box\'s and such but i dont think they are that great for the effort and expense and still no gaurantee they will hold either
or the other root would be the Supra Six speed with a bell housing adapter, they were designed out the factory to hold 500bhp as standard.
Or the other proven root for high horsepower is the HKS dog boxes they rock solid cost about £3k for H pattern and £6K for sequential, proven in Dragons 9.1 second drag car
what route you going this year mark???
im having a go at cryo freezing an fd box in a couple of months along with an 8 box ;)
colum
Corect me if I am wrong but Cryo freezing metal does increase the strength but also makes the metal alot more brittle IIRC. In a gearbox is this a good idea?
I could be totally wrong just want to get my head around it.
apparently makes it 4 times as strong by altering the mollecular structure of the parts frozen.
wrc and f1 have being doing it for years
let me know how you get on, i fancy doing one!
will do matt
Quote from: mx1311;518958what route you going this year mark???
im having a go at cryo freezing an fd box in a couple of months along with an 8 box ;)
colum
going to get a spare FD box when funds allow as I sp*nked so much money on the car this year.
Was thinking of going Supra gearbox or HKS dog box in Winter or next year.
But let us know how the cyro freezing goes as this may be an option, as I do like the standard FD box
I remember on of the Supra guys getting some parts of his gearbox shot peened, I think it was the forks and some moly bearings. I\'m no expert on gearboxes yet, but his R154 is holding 770hp and they can only take about 500hp stock and then not for long.
That might be a cheaper option but it\'s going to be a lot in labour unless you can take the box to pieces on your own.
Quote from: BlitzBoy;518976going to get a spare FD box when funds allow as I sp*nked so much money on the car this year.
Was thinking of going Supra gearbox or HKS dog box in Winter or next year.
But let us know how the cyro freezing goes as this may be an option, as I do like the standard FD box
james is selling his trust dog box, just being rebuilt but has no reverse gear
also gonna try some of that shock oil s**t too dude see if that helps in a standard fd box, will keep you posted
Are there any company out there that sell an off the shelf bell housing for the supra \'box to fit the FD engine?
no off the shelf bellhousing, just buy the adapter plate which mates between the FD bellhousing and the supra box, two companies in OZ do them, cant remember who at the mo
ah, there\'s an adapter plate, eh? Cunning!
What clutch do you use - the FD one? And I assume the gearbox needs modifying so that it\'ll take the FD PPF?
FD one I believe, yes it will need modifying
Quote from: mx1311;518958what route you going this year mark???
im having a go at cryo freezing an fd box in a couple of months along with an 8 box ;)
colum
How do I explain the gearbox in the freezer to the missus then?
;)
Quote from: Lil-Steve;518979I remember on of the Supra guys getting some parts of his gearbox shot peened, I think it was the forks and some moly bearings. I\'m no expert on gearboxes yet, but his R154 is holding 770hp and they can only take about 500hp stock and then not for long.
That might be a cheaper option but it\'s going to be a lot in labour unless you can take the box to pieces on your own.
Shot peening wont add any static strength to the materials ie. what the maximum power/torque they can take is. It will however improve their fatigue life as it compresses the top layer of the material and causes residual compressive stress on the surface where fatigue cracks start. As you only get fatigue issues in tension this compressive preload reduces the tension in the surface therefore increasing fatigue resistance. Basically this might increase a box\'s reliability, if you\'re finding a box takes the power but only for a few thousand miles for example this might work well.
Quote from: Gatesy;518963Corect me if I am wrong but Cryo freezing metal does increase the strength but also makes the metal alot more brittle IIRC. In a gearbox is this a good idea?
I could be totally wrong just want to get my head around it.
Not too sure about cyro freeze treatment, however it\'s likely the parts will be more brittle but they will also be tougher and have better wear resistance as well as the added strength. As long as the treatment is done to sensible level I wouldn\'t think they would be too brittle and cause a problem.
Quote from: BlitzBoy;518952or the other root would be the Supra Six speed with a bell housing adapter, they were designed out the factory to hold 500bhp as standard.
Or the other proven root for high horsepower is the HKS dog boxes they rock solid cost about £3k for H pattern and £6K for sequential, proven in Dragons 9.1 second drag car
Sorry blitz is that for the complete gearbox or the gear kit and would you need the kit fitting?.
That\'s bloody reasonable for a dog box compared to a lot off the cosworth upgrades I was looking into for my saph.
Regards
Matt
thats the whole box , these are second hand values mind from Japan
Personaly I think its all in the way you drive. Another thing that would brake your gear box will be the type of clutch you have & tyres.
You must remeber that once traction is obtained there are only 3 other things to let go, axels, gears & diffs. This is why I will not drag race my FD, only circuit race it.
I have seen people break FD gear boxes with a stock Motor....mainly due to hard shifting and what not.
I recomend an Exedy D core twin plate carbon clutch. The D stands for (Damper). It is designed for racing to reduce shock through the drive train, this helps not to brake axels, diffs & gears. I use 1 on my FD. It operates just like a stocker, only with more pressure & bite. When they get hotter they grip more. Great for high powerd street cars.
As I said before about the traction, its better to spin than to hook up & break something. I use Goodyear eagel F1\'s 265 on my FD....perfect for wet weather & spin up very easily if I feel the need to cane 1st gear. Once going you have traction & the load on the gears between shifts is not as harsh.
I always tell people, drive the car to its abilitys, EG: The speed of the shift through gear should be felt & placed correctly not pushed & forced, thats when you brake stuff. Those guys that shift & drop the clutch through every gear & chirp the wheels on nearly every gear change are the ones that brake drive line equipment.
My 2c.