Hi all,
OK, bought car, 1 week later water seal failure ! Grrr
Bought recently rebuilt engine and installed OK. On new engine tho I boost fine on primary, but when 2nd turbo kicks in I get a boost spike from 1 bar to up to 1.2 bar !!, Now I know this isnt good and the ECU isnt mapped for it so obviously Im not booting it around.
Its a 93 \'L\' which has filters, de-cat and rear box. The new engine was from a 92 \'J\'. Ive tried the ECU from my original engine and replaced the cat back on it but still has the problem. Checked all obvious hoses and they are all OK.
Any ideas ?! because I daren\'t put my foot down for fear of blowing this engine !!!
Could I have done any damage to it on the few occasions it has spiked or is it a case of it either goes pop or it doesnt ? It still starts fine, and idles fine so Im hoping there hasnt been ay damage ?
Thanks for your help !
hi mate, a bit off topic but if you still have your dead engine could you email me at:
oscar.andrews@solodesigns.co.uk (oscar.andrews@solodesigns.co.uk)
i would be interested in buying it!
sorry i cant help with your spiking!
I doubt you have done damage by the sound of it, But there is a chance of it if you keep doing it. when you say obvious hoses do you mean the vac hoses under the plenum chamber and the ones down the left hand side above the turbo\'s?
Check the boost controller as sometimes they dont hold boost correctly and spike. Just be careful until resolved a quick spike to 1.2bar might be ok on ocassion but dont let this continue bud.
Also check the boost controller wires in the engine bay for wear - depends of course if you have a boost controller ???
Quote from: Dr1ft_KingHi all,
OK, bought car, 1 week later water seal failure ! Grrr
Bought recently rebuilt engine and installed OK. On new engine tho I boost fine on primary, but when 2nd turbo kicks in I get a boost spike from 1 bar to up to 1.2 bar !!, Now I know this isnt good and the ECU isnt mapped for it so obviously Im not booting it around.
Its a 93 \'L\' which has filters, de-cat and rear box. The new engine was from a 92 \'J\'. Ive tried the ECU from my original engine and replaced the cat back on it but still has the problem. Checked all obvious hoses and they are all OK.
Any ideas ?! because I daren\'t put my foot down for fear of blowing this engine !!!
Could I have done any damage to it on the few occasions it has spiked or is it a case of it either goes pop or it doesnt ? It still starts fine, and idles fine so Im hoping there hasnt been ay damage ?
Thanks for your help !
dont worry its a common problem!!
are you still on stock ecu or an un tuned powe fc??
either way the additional flow from your de cat and filter will cause over boost, which in turn can easily cause leaning out of the mixture..
DONT BOOST THE CAR!!!
get a power fc and get it mapped asap to avoid popping your seals matey..
cheers
Rmaj
have you put the pill in the vac pipe? if its missing you will get mad boost spikes, the Decat pipe will 99% sure be the problem but i had this problem and found a Profect B2 boost controler really helped.
out of intrest what other mods have you got? 1 bar of boost is quite allot to be set as a target boost on a fairly stock fuel system.
bottom left of the Diagram (Prespool control), Worth a look.
sounds to me like the boost pill is missing
Thanks for the advice, I dont have a boost controller tho and ive put the cat back on it and its still doing it ??
So at the moment all I have diff from standard is the air filters and a backbox, surely that wouldnt be enough to cause it to spike ?
Whats this boost pill thingy then ??
Using the stock ECU, tried 2 standard ones to make sure that the new one didnt have any piggybacking done to it but it made no difference.
The restricter pill will limit the boost. I think it will hit 1.2 bar with no pill in but dont quote me on that. The exhaust is a red hearing. The boost issue is charge control related not ecu. The fd runs a open loop system.
If all else fails i would suggest talking to a rotary minded mechanic
S
Quote from: Dr1ft_KingThanks for the advice, I dont have a boost controller tho and ive put the cat back on it and its still doing it ??
So at the moment all I have diff from standard is the air filters and a backbox, surely that wouldnt be enough to cause it to spike ?
Whats this boost pill thingy then ??
You can cheat a bit, just fit a Greddy Profect B2 (best way around it)
Quote from: Dr1ft_KingThanks for the advice, I dont have a boost controller tho and ive put the cat back on it and its still doing it ??
So at the moment all I have diff from standard is the air filters and a backbox, surely that wouldnt be enough to cause it to spike ?
Whats this boost pill thingy then ??
You can cheat a bit, just fit a Greddy Profect B2 (best way around it)
Hope it helps.
Quote from: gillard28The exhaust is a red hearing.
What you mean is the Decat with a stock ecu would not hit 1.2 bar (which by the way is .2 bar over the max stock fuel system limit the weather is proberly the only thing stopping your motor dropping a seal at that pressure.) Standard Target boost is something like 8-6-8psi (about .6 bar max) thats way off 1.2 (about 17psi) with a Decat you would see one of these faults, you would find it would boost ok but is you put it in third at 30mph going up a hill it would creep past the target boost or if you floored it in second and third it would spike past the Target boost then drop back to just over, ether way is not good. But what you are describing is more constant so is more likly to be a fault.
So where is this boost pill ?
bottom left on the Diagram above ^
i had this and pip said either apexi or fit a choke gasket in the exhaust system- basically a gasket with a 2" hole instead of the de-cat 3" hole, suggested making it out of thin steel myself. i opted for the apexi though. jon.
Do you mean Apexi Power FC or apexi Boost controler Because they would both sort the problem in diffrent ways. (PFC would just cover the extra boost with the fuel so it didn\'t run lean and the Boost controler would pre empt the Spike and manage it better)
BTW Profet B2 is the Boost controler to buy if you go that way ;)
apexi power fc with remap. the fc was programed to limit boost to .75 and sorted fuelling. pip said boost controller would sort out boost but car would still lean out. also said original ecu would not last long trying to cope with extra loads. with apexi intake + 3" straight through exhaust and fc now getting 300 at wheels and runs sweet.
Apexi power FC ecu can and does control boost and boost can be altered exactly as a boost controller.
On stock twins you don\'t need a boost controller,just get power FC and get it mapped.
It could just be that the pill is missing as some have said.
Regards
Carl
Carl, Does the PFC still control the boost if it doesn\'t have the extra Amal valve? I was led to belive the PFC was not good at controling the boost??
Quote from: jon hainesapexi power fc with remap. the fc was programed to limit boost to .75 and sorted fuelling. pip said boost controller would sort out boost but car would still lean out. also said original ecu would not last long trying to cope with extra loads. with apexi intake + 3" straight through exhaust and fc now getting 300 at wheels and runs sweet.
This confuses me, if you where not going for the extra power and was just dealing with the boost problem i don\'t get why the ecu would fail sooner or lean out if a boost controler limited the boost to the factory target boost?
Don\'t get me wrong though its proberly not the way to go (temp fix until you bought a PFC) but it would be the exhaust/induction kit that would cause it to lean out rather than the boost?
Quote from: GrizzlyCarl, Does the PFC still control the boost if it doesn\'t have the extra Amal valve? I was led to belive the PFC was not good at controling the boost??
I have not come across a combo on twins that have the pills in that I cannot control the boost yet.
It takes a bit of perseverance but can be done,after all the PFC is only controlling boost in exactly the same way that a boost controller does with the exception that it uses the stock solenoids.
Regards
Carl
Carl: Are you saying you can controll boost with a full through exhaust, say Vmount, airfilters and stock/aftermarket boostcontroller without boostspiking on stock twins? I am still thinking of contacting you after talking to Miguel@newera regarding tuners, but this sounds a little incredible since I hear so many stories of boostcreeping.. Spiking is one thing, but creeping?
I can vouch for the Profect B2 route, i had some really wacky overboosting problems that where sorted by fitting a Profect b (and spending a bit of time setting it up properly), TBH now i know the PFC does control the boost as well as Fuel it wouldn\'t suprise me if it could keep the boost in check with the right person tweeking it.
Quote from: chrnoCarl: Are you saying you can controll boost with a full through exhaust, say Vmount, airfilters and stock/aftermarket boostcontroller without boostspiking on stock twins? I am still thinking of contacting you after talking to Miguel@newera regarding tuners, but this sounds a little incredible since I hear so many stories of boostcreeping.. Spiking is one thing, but creeping?
It can be done,as yet I have not come acrross a combination with twins that we have not been able to get under control.
What boost are you running and how high is it spiking?
Regards
Carl
Carl: I will give you a call tomorrow or Friday, but basically I have not set up the car yet.. Mods I am running/will run is Greddy intake w hardpipes(fitted),Vmount(fitted),850/850 injectors(waiting for you),SARD 280l/h fuelpump(fitted),Feed Downpipe 3(waiting in garage)",Feed silenced midpipe 3"(Waiting in garage),Trust catback(Fitted), PFC(fitted running default map)Prodec b2(fitted but turned of, installed on both prespool and wastegate)
Basically I don\'t have a problem yet, but as I read alot of people having problems with creeps and spikes running full through exhaust on std turbos I am a bit worried. My bost is 0.5 first and second turbo atm.
Thank you for your reply
Regards, Daniel Gardh