Mazda Rotary Club

Hiya chaps

breaking away from the other thread of the "car wont work" as its getting a bit confusing in there :D

so starting a nice clean thread ( for now - who knows where it will end up !! )

so anyways ...

i cant get the lights to work on the cab

the wont come on and they wont pop up using the switch

i have tried 4 switches with no luck

this is where i am now : ( see pic )

1 - put 12v to this and the lights come on
2 - put 12v to this and the lights come on
3 - put 12v to this and the lights come on
4 - put 12v to this and the lights come on
5 - put 12v to this and i get a BUZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ noise

and none of these make the lights pop up

HELPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP :D :D :D

Stu

If you look very carefully the pins on the relay are marked:
 
1 NO - Normally Open
4 NC - Normally Closed
2 COM - Common Power
3 COIL - Coil
5 COIL - Coil
 
I assume you mean that you are putting 12V on the socket side of this relay and that this is the headlight relay?
 
If you put 12V across 3 and 5 of the relay you should get the relay to click.
 
If you put 12V on 3 or 5 in the socket it should have no effect.
 
Pin 2 in the socket should normally be at 12V. Connecting this pin to pins 1 and then 4 should make the lights go on and then off on high or low beam according to the stalk control. In the socket only one of pins 1 and 4 will be connected. That connection runs to the dashboard
 
The headlight relay doesn\'t make the lights pop-up.
 
I\'ve run out of time to help, there is an FC wiring diagram on RX7club.com, it is similar to this from the FD
 
(http://www.mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=25123&d=1163113157)

Here\'s a diagram from the US pdf\'s - I am guessing Jap spec is similar and does not havee \'dip dim\' circuit.

The relay you have should be for selecting low beam / hi beam as far as I can tell.

hiya chaps :D

well thats very confusing !! LOL

so what it looks like then is that i have the relay for dim and dip - so OK thats not a problem !

all i need to do now is work out which one does the actual head light motors !!

there is a round connector near the back of the lights - i think this does the motors - just need to sus out which pin sends power to them !!

i must admit im hopeless with electronics and cant read a wiring diagram for the life of me ! LOL

im wonder if i can just cheat - and send 12v down the retractor line and see what happens ??

Stu

You should be able to - that\'s pretty much what the retractor overide switch does.

had another 4 mins on the car !! LOL

just got the bonnet up and the better half came back :(

undid the round connector at the back of the headlight ( behind the battery )

there are 4 pins in there - applied power to each one and NOTHING

this is really proving interesting

any one know how to get the motors out ??

Stu

I take it your playing with the Probe Stu :)

when u touched the probe on the connector,  did it turn green,

Have you got a diffrent Power Probe to me? Mine shows red for Power and green for Neg?

Stu, Don\'t rule out the Pop up motors arn\'t Stuck or Corroded, when i bought my car mine where open slightly and it had me running round for Three days scratching my head, I found with mine when the Motors stick The lights can still be put up and down (with the Aux Lights up switch) if its the Motors this don\'t work.

Also Don\'t trust the main Light switch, if its been stood a while my Lights used to stop working, if i played with the Switch it would sudernly start up again.

Yes, they all do, :)  what i mean is, if he touches a pin without pressing the button,  does it go green,

Mick

errrr to be honest - not sure if it went green or not ???

should it go green - or is this bad ??

even with the lights wound up - they still dont come on or off ??

i dont know if its really bad wiring from the switch or what :(

Stu

If it goes green, you know the headlight is connected to the relay,  if there is nothing there, the headlight will be unplugged,  even if the light is knackd, u will still get green light

Feed the wires from the switch, if the lights work  then u know switch is faulty,
If it doesnt light anything,, then feed the relay, if that doesnt work,  check the connections on the light(headlamp)

th

thanks guys :D

i will check what colour light i get on the relay and i will try and feed it from the switch end and see what happens

we know that feeding the relay works - as i can get the lights to come on from there

if i get 20 mins today i will try it :D

i will report back with finding and pics if possible

Stu

Stu,
 
do the lights come on from the light switch - or is that only when you put 12v on that relay ?
 
If that\'s the case, locate the other relay that feeds the one you\'ve been playing with - it will have only 4 wires connected.  This connection from the COM relay on the one in the picture connects to the NO connection on the relay with 4 wires. This is the headlight relay - not the dip/dim.  On the COM terminal of this relay - try jumpering 12V feed straight from the 30A lights fuse to that terminal - that may then operate the lights at least from the switch.

dave ,

i can only get them to work by jumpering the relay

i tried to test another relay at the side of this one - and that puts the lights on aswell

what i need to do is work out whats dim/dip and what the other one is

i might wind them up by hand and see what lights with what relay ( as i cant really tell when they are down - you just get light )

the only thing im thinking aswell is ... is the jap spec light switch different to the UK one ???

i cant even test what mine does when you apply power as mine is a UK spec - although it could be worth a try :D

Stu

not had a chance to play yet - but i think you are right - this connector is a dimmer relay - so not sure what it does

i will do some more digging around to see what i can find

there must be a simple way to check if the motors are OK :(

Stu

Prof : looking at your diagram - would applying 12v to either RD or RU make the headlight motors work - or im i thinking too simple ??

I reckon that should work - because that\'s all the relay and the switch does inside the light switch cluster.  I haven\'t tried that on mine.  Give it a go - you shouldn\'t be able to do any harm :yes  - at least you\'ll know if the motors are working.

not played today with it - took the coupe out for a spin instead :D - although i think the heater matrix is leaking on it :(

hiya chaps

right then more progress :D :D :D

1 - got the power probe out - what a coooool toy
2 - had a look round the relays at the front - and go the lights to work again ( so we know bulbs are ok )
3 - put power to pin RU and the passenger side came up - but not the drivers side
4 - put power to pin RD and the light went down
5 - do this a few times with a grin on my face
6 - got out and the drivers side was now in a sleepy position ( about 1.5 inch up )
7 - try to wind it by hand and stiff as hell
8 - got a socket on the hand winder and wound it fully up
9 - sprayed it with LOADS of WD40
10 - back in the car - using pins Ru and RD - got both lights to now move up and down
11 - this proves that the motors are OK
12 - put 12v to a few more pins and got the lights to work
13 - put a switch on ... and NOTHING
14 - next switch - NOTHING
15 - next switch - NOTHING

so looked at the 3 switches i have and they are marked

M94
U18
K63

so the prob is now - which one is which and why wont none of them work

i know one is from a UK S5 as its a spare of mine , i think one is a S4 as the guy said he bought a second hand surround from a S4 and the other - is this the original one

so the prob now is - do i need a jap spec switch - and how the hell do i know which one it is ??

ideas welcomed at this point :D

Stu

If it helps i\'ve got a Head light Switch knocking about some where, it was working fine when i took it off but its been sat in a Draw for about 18 months. I\'ll have a look in the Morning too see what code is on it.

You can have it if you want?

BTW if the Motors Pop up Motors are tight there is a fair chance they want stripping and the Terminals inside cleaning up if not they kind of work when they want too.

Have you checked what happens to the Conections when its all conected up?

If you can pop the lights up / Turn them on and off from inside then surly its ether the Switch or Power too it?

Have you checked the Fuses:Thumbs-up

Stu,
 
The RD / RU pins your feeding 12v to - are they on the connector end in the car - the plug that goes into the switch ?
 
If so, then my guess is that maybe the 12V feed to the switch is dead - this is via the 30A light fuse - maybe the wire has gone ?

Hey Stu,  was ur ears burning last night. :)

I ran outta petrol, Stoopid car says 1/4 tanks, but that means empty :(

So called out AA guy, and he got it running, and he was talking about another RX in Chorley,  and it was the same guy who came to yours :) :) :)

Small world  lol

Anyhow, me car still shakes at 70mph,  that stoopid beepin noise comes on at 63mph grrr.  and me fuel gauge is out  :(

Mick

AA man - not a balded headed chap called dave was it ??

and he could have meant jons ( next doors )

i dont trust my fuel gauge anyways - i work on milage

and the lights - it works fine if you apply voltage thru the block connector - just not with the switch

i can get side lights on - so this should prove that there is power to the switch and the dash lights come on - just no up or down :(

fuses check out fine - as they work with the power probe and so do the relays

i might get out with the old multimeter and see if there is 12v at the switch ?

Stu

( chris - yeah if you can get the code of the switch - thats great !! )

Stu,

BA should have 12V on it, but when you pull the 30A lights fuse it should go dead - might be worth checking that with your power probe or multimeter.

If this is good, then you\'ve got 12V going to the switch, so the problem does not lie with the wiring but the switch.


Then, if you can feed 12V to the BA pin on the switch, do the RU/RD pins get 12V alternately when you operate the headlight raise switch ?

If this doesn\'t work, then the switch is faulty - possibly burnt out track on the PCB.  If you had a short in the wiring loom, you may have \'blown\' all the switches you\'ve tested with - try removing the white plastic cover and take a look at the tracking on the PCB.

ahhh i see your way of thinking Dave

gonna be a squeeze with the probe , meter and half the dash in my hand - but this should narrow down a lot of probs :D

i will rip apart the swithces and see whats going on - we tried to check the swithces for resistance - but we couldnt get much - i cant see how we have blown up 3 switches though ???

stu

Naa he was called colin. :)

Did you try feeding the 4 pin round connectors , see if the lights go up.

tried that mick - nothing happened :(

so no idea what that means to be honest

but everything must be working ( ish ) as i can get them to come up from the dash connector ??

Stu

BA - bollxs i was trying with BTN - and on that i dont actaully have a wire to BTN anyways

can anyone lend me a hand setting fire to this peice of sh1t i have on my drive way :(

this is the state of play

1 - block connector pin out ( as of FSM )

XX-RD-RU(PLASTIC)XX-HR-HBO
IL-BTN-TNS-E-BA-HC-DEF-TIG
( XX means no wire )

2 - what i actaully have

??-RD-RU(PLASTIC)??-HR-HBO
IL-XX-TNS-XX-BA-HC-DEF-TIG

(XX means no pin)
(?? have pin no idea what it does )

3 - what does what

IL - Dash Illumination
RD - Lights Up
RU - Lights Down ( surely D=down / U=up - but who knows ?? )
TNS - Side Lights and lights on Buzzer
HR - High Beam and indicator on dash
?? - Near HR - no idea what this does - if anything

i cant get the dim lights to work on any of the connectors - so NO IDEA why not

the lights dont pop up or down when you put full beam on - but i thought they did on a jap model - unless this is controlled by the actual switch some how ??

i dont think the FSM is helping as this is a jap spec car and could be completly different from the US/UK ones - and also would seem different from the S4 aswell

so im at a real loose with the car at the mo - as i have no idea what pins should do what and when

i can get a light switch to put the side lights on and all the dash lights up ( even the switch lights ) - so i assume that there is power somewhere - i just cant for the life of me work out why they wont pop up and down

Stu :(

BA is where the power should be coming from - it should power the relay that drives RU / RD, and also feeds the pop up switch which always overides the relay - switch is up - lights up (but not on) - switch down - lights obey relay (lights on - lights up  / Lights off - lights down).
 
So the switch itself should be tested - if feeding 12V to BA and operating the switch doesn\'t raise the lights, then the  switch or pcb tracks are fried.  If you had a short in the wiring loom at some point - or one of the motors was jammed and caused a heavy load on the circuit, it could have burnt out the pcb track - and if you tested with other switches these may have gone as well.
 
Assuming you can get the switch to work, then the next likely thing to have failed is the relay in the switch - these relays are a little bit ****ty - the ones in the wiper switch are notorious for failing - Farnell or RS do an exact OMRON replacement part - which is far superior - I had to do this on my wiper switch, but also had to repair the actual rotating switch part and the pcb as both of these got fried by a short in the loom

thanks prof

i will have another look tonight and see whats going on

so if im getting 12v to BA and 0v to rd/ru when the light switch is operated - then we can guess that i have a lot of broken switches ??

i had a look at the inside of a switch and it seems OK to be honest

unless the probs lie with it being a jap car and i have no idea what switches im using !! LOL

Stu

hiya chaps me again :D

right then BA is only seeing about 5v - so this is a problem

i stuck the power probe in the back with a light switch attached and got the lights to pop up and down on the switch - so partial success :D

now more probs have arose

1 - i can still get side lights and the lights stay down ( as they should )
2 - next click on the switch - lights pop up
3 - but no lights come on
4 - no dip , no full beam
5 - indicators have stopped working aswell - but by powering the connector they do work

so do i need the indicator switch to work to determine if its dip beam or full beam ???

and they worked yesterday so why not today :(

managed to blow the illum fuse - so changed that aswell - but the indicator one seems fine

and i even got the maintenance switch to work

so now i need to do ..

1 - get 12v to the main switch - not sure how though
2 - get the indicators to work
3 - get dip / full beam to work

the head fuse is only seeing about 8v and thats dropping to just over 5v at the cluster - any ideas why ??

come on chaps - im nearly there :D :D :D

Stu

Yep - I can help you there.
 
The 12V feed to the switch comes off the 30A lights fuse, and then enters that crappy loom that runs in front of the radiator.  It has joins in it, and gets all the weather God throws at it - so you get corrosion and poor joints.
 
Basically your wiring loom has faults in it - there are 2 solutions :
 
1) Get the bumper off or crawl underneath and try and find the bad connection and repair it
 
or
 
2) Run a new 12V feed from the fuse to the switch - or intercept the wiring loom on the drivers side near the Pressure sensor and cut the original 12V wire and stick your new one in place.  Recommend solder joints with heatshrink on if you can.  You may also want to consider feeding the same 12V wire to the relays to keep them happy as well.

not exactly what i wanted to hear - but its a start :D

but the fuse is only seeing 8v - and thats only about 6 inch from the battery - so could the probs be at that end

im assuming that i can check the resistance of the wires once i match the colours and such like and try and trace it around

will it be a bad connector - or just wire thats bad ?

just out of interest .. how do the wires run

battery  -> 30amp fuse -> cluster -> switch

or something else

just so i know where to get for voltages and where it seems to be dropping

stu
( sooo close i can smell success )

Stu,

When I followed the routing on mine, the feed from the fuse joins the wiring harness with the headlamp washer, and then passes down in front of the radiator and oil cooler.  There are a number of spurs off this to the lights, relays and so on, but this whole harness then passes around the drivers side and along by the strut tower and through the bulkhead to a large connector - from there it passes to the cluster switches.  The joins are in the 12V feed and are inside that harness that is attached to the pipe that runs in front of the oil cooler - I think it has something to do with the power steering system - the pipe that is.

By \'wiggling\' the bulges in this I was able to get better/worse connectivity - and I have seen one of these harnesses stripped bare as well - but I can\'t remember what type of connections are used.  It may have been crimped or soldered - but that was 16 years ago, and weather takes it\'s toll on this.

Try the flying wire - it worked for me - got me through the MOT - I will strip it completley and replace this coming year - but the hot wire works well for now.

i will have a look tonight and see if i can see some bulges :D

and what flying wire are you on about ??

running a 12v feed to the back of the switch ???

i must admit - im not sure where to start

Fuse
Battery
Switch
Harness
Bulkhead connector

the fact that i only see 8v at the fuse means it must be bad around that area somewhere ??

i have looked at the harness and can say that they are still covered up and NO exposed wires

Stu

Flying wire - I put a wire in between 30A fuse (after the fuse - as battery to fuse was ok) to the lights relay, as that was where the fault was on my loom.  I had over 30 Ohms resistance between fuse and the relay - it should be fractions of an ohm.

The symptom was that I could operate the headlight motors, but as soon as I turned on more than sidelights, the lights would drop and the relay\'s buzzed.  By disconnecting the lights themselves I could get the motors to work and get the relays to hold, but as soon as the load from even 1 light was present there was insufficient voltage to hold them on.

You could make the same measurements as I did :

Resistance between battery positive and hot side of the 30A fuse, resistance between cold side of fuse and lights relay red/green wire (not the lo/hi beam - the other one that feeds it) and the resistance between BA on switch and the relay - can\'t remember wire colour :(

I had good low resistance between the switch and relay - so wiring loom was good here, bad resistance between relay and fuse, good between fuse and battery.  So I needed to jumper a wire between fuse and relay - I used heavy gauge multistrand copper wire - capable of 25A - the lights on full beam take 10A !!

If you want - take the readings and let me know what values you get.  Don\'t forget - unplug the switch, relays and fuse - you don\'t want any part of the circuit having 12V on it and cocking up the readings !

good man dave

makes much more sense now

just need more hands to test from inside the car to the outside with a meter

i like you error checking theories though :D - makes sense now

and i can bell it thru aswell to see what wire goes where - and then check it for resistance - im praying that its not a massive piece thats faulty

and idea on why the lights come up but dont come on ??

do i need a set of working switches ( headlights and indicators ? )

Stu

Quote from: grindergood man dave

and idea on why the lights come up but dont come on ??

Have you checked the actual bulbs yet?

Edit- scrap that, Just read the first page. Always late.

Kron -  see the first post :D

Stu, I\'ve found the Light switch (hence the delay) Where exactly am i looking for the code?

The only thing i can see is on the Clear\'ish Plug part of the Switch, That says W01, I know it was Working fine when it came off the car.

I have also found a Indicator switch if thats any Use to you. (That only has 513319 stamped in the back of it??)

If you want them PM me your Address and i\'ll send them over to you.

cheers chris

can you keep hold of them for a day or so - i MIGHT have figured it out - just need to check a few final things

W01 - so thats not the same as my codes either - any idea if they are UK spec or JAP/US etc..

Stu

Urm i\'m not sure but i would guess its a UK one becouse i\'ve only ever owned 1 Jap T2 and i\'m 80% sure it did\'nt come off that.

Yeh no problem, The only reason they came out was to see if they where any use so they don\'t have any Purpose lined up.

need to check the wiring as of Profs post - and then work out what i need :D

thanks again for the offer though - if you make it to the dec meet - i could collect then ?

Thats the 11th isn\'t it? I\'m not saying if i\'ll be there becouse that will just Curse it. ;)

yeah it is mate

I`ll find it easier this time :)  getting me wheels balanced and me trackin done,  so no more shakes at 70mph hopefully,

Oh and me clocks make a loud buzzing noise ,as soon as ignition is on, apart from desolder the buzzer

 any ideas stu ?

Ti
Mick

how long does it buzz for - this is usually a sign that the door is open with the keys in - or you have the door open and the lights on

any of these ???

right then back to the headlight issues

1 - spent 3 hrs on the car tonight
2 - cant get continuety (sp) to the switch or the relays
3 - mate came over to help ( hes the clever one who knows his stuff )
4 - showed him what happened when you use the probe on the cluster - so i could prove the motors work and all the bulbs
5 - got the FULL beam to work ( using the probe )
6 - after lots of playing and looking and scratching of heads he bridges the light relay to 12v - the lights now work on the switch - so this is pretty cool
7 - we then advanced this to adding 12v to the cluster ( BA ) using the probe - we now get lights to come on , and up , and off etc...
8 - only thing i DIDNT check was to see what the full beam did with the lights down ( why didnt i think of this ?? )
9 - only seeing about 10v on the BA connector and we assume that this isnt enough to switch the relay inside the switch to power the lights
10 - we tested this by taking a wire from BA to RD and the lights didnt rise
11 - put the probe into RD and the lights come up
12 - so in answering my own question 10v isnt enough to raise the headlights !! LOL
13 - found 3 blown fuses and now the indicators work again :D ( and the lights on buzzer )

SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

looks like there is a problem in the wiring

the 12v feed from the 30a fuse feeds both the headlight relays AND the switch in the cluster - so it looks like its broken before it splits off

so we have a choice now

1 - add 2 fly wires and fix it in a few hrs
2 - cut back all the harness and try to find the fault

this is where it gets tricky for me - i like the idea of finding the fault and fixing it ( big job cutting all the harness ) - on the other hand a quick fix is a simple fix

if i took this to a garage - they would prob run 2 wires from the fuse the relay and the switch - tell me it works and charge me £££ - and i would prob be happy at this

so why dont i like the idea of me and my mate doing it - im i trying to be tooo strick and make all the wiring look like stock mazda stuff - or should i appreciate that its a 15-16 yrs old car - and 2 extra red wires isnt a problem ??

there is light at the end of this tunnel - im just not sure how many more bends there are in it !! LOL

Stu
( need to find out what the full beam does when the lights are down and the  relay is bridged and 12v applied to the BA feed )

i would recommend pullling the loom apart stu,  it might fix other probs in the future.

Buzzing...

Yeah i noticed me door open light on as well, but all doors closed. it never used to beep before, when the doors were open,?

This has only happenend since me elec friend, tried to fix the rev couner not, said he saw a screw half in, and screwed it in full,  but wont seee him till tommoz,  so wont know which one,

Mick

no idea what your prob is mick - but elec based !! LOL

and the loom - really dont fancy hacking into it to be honest :(

Stu

Stu
this guy may be of some use if you need  light parts as he is not far from you
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mazda-Rx7-turbo-gen2-parts-spares-breaking-DOORS_W0QQitemZ270060949571QQihZ017QQcategoryZ52640QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

thanks grant - that used to be a members car on here

thing is i dont know which part of the loom i need and how far it runs

might be easier just to run 2 extra "live" feeds - this way i know where they are , what they do , and shouldnt fail for the next 20 yrs !!

thanks for the info though :D

Stu

Speedo packed in as well :(  So gonna grab them clocks from macclesfield.  and see if it behaves,  desoldered the buzzer,  so no more beeping, :)

Mick

from the black ebay one ????

The next post on here had better be about working head lights!

sorry brett :(

not looked at the car for a few days to be honest and i have been working today and tommorrow ( they joy of overtime )

i was waiting for people to comment about me either cutting into the loom or just adding 2 extra wires - but the only person to comment was mick - so was just waiting to see what happened really :D

Stu

Quotefrom the black ebay one ????

Naa the one of Grizzly :)

Stu
if it was me, i like to keep things simple, so i would try the wire from a live feed first to the motor and only if that worked would  i try tracing the loom back or even put a new feed as you said.
:wave

didnt realise griz had some clocks ??

and Grant - we have already tested it with temp wires and this is the only way to get the lights to work - so like i said 2 choices

1 - rip apart loom and find it
2 - wire in 2 wires

humm ??????????

Stu

I would put a new wire in then at least you would be sure you have fixed the problem asuming the switch and relay are ok.
good to here you are getting there though :WaveBye

grant

i think thats the best idea to be honest - and a quick fix ( i assume a garage would only do the same )

its been nice ( well OK it hasnt ) getting all these probs as im know a bit more knowledgable about the car and its working :D

im hoping to get this sorted this week , then fit the back boxes ready for the MOT in jan :D

just awaiting for the response from the DVLA aswell :D

hiya chaps - bit of an update

fitted all new wires for the headlights - they now work fine on the switch

BUT

when you flash to pass - the head lights stay down and flash

now this is a prob as the FTP lenses on the jap car are solid ( not see-thru - and have the side lights in them )

so its now 2 things

1 - more dodgy wiring ( but cant find a jap spec wiring diagram )
2 - is it the switch thats faulty

ideas welcomed

Stu / Grinder

Stu
this seems to be a problem with most T11, if you want to flash??  just use the main switch which is much more reliable.

Quote from: grinderhiya chaps - bit of an update

fitted all new wires for the headlights - they now work fine on the switch

BUT

when you flash to pass - the head lights stay down and flash

now this is a prob as the FTP lenses on the jap car are solid ( not see-thru - and have the side lights in them )

so its now 2 things

1 - more dodgy wiring ( but cant find a jap spec wiring diagram )
2 - is it the switch thats faulty

ideas welcomed

Stu / Grinder

Have you tried holding the flash for longer to allow the lights to pop up ?????  :Giggle :spank :spank

hiya chaps

held the switch for about 15 seconds - lights stay down :(

the UK spec cars are supposed to flash thru the FTP lenses - as they are clear - the jap ones arent :(

Stu

Quote from: grinderhiya chaps - bit of an update
 
fitted all new wires for the headlights - they now work fine on the switch
 
BUT
 
when you flash to pass - the head lights stay down and flash
 
now this is a prob as the FTP lenses on the jap car are solid ( not see-thru - and have the side lights in them )
 
so its now 2 things
 
1 - more dodgy wiring ( but cant find a jap spec wiring diagram )
2 - is it the switch thats faulty
 
ideas welcomed
 
Stu / Grinder

Stu,
 
Just get a pair of clear FTP\'s - that should cure the problem ! :)

prob with that matey - where do i put the side lights ??

my side lights are physically mounted INTO the FTP lenses :(

gonna try my switches on a S4 Jap spec car at the weekend to see what it does with my switches

if i need to get jap switches - i see problems :(

Put them where every one elses are (next to the Indicator).

its a lot of work :(

and the indicators are all orange - not split like the UK ones

nothing is simple eh

Let me know if ur coming down stu,  cos i took the RX home,  ran out of room at the inn :)

Mick - yeah im hoping to bob down tommorrow - just need to know

1 - is the car there
2 - what time

Stu

Hi Folks,
I have a problem where one headlight is stuck down. The lights come on okay. I can feel the drive motor and it\'s warm so there is power getting too it but nothing is moving. I was told that there is a manual means of raising them but I can\'t seem to find it. This happened after many wet and salty motorway miles and I guess that the mechanism has just siezed up but I can\'t get to the mechanism without getting the headlamp up in the first place. Any ideas how I might raise the headlamp? Many thanks...:xconfused

if you stick your head underneath the front bumper there will be a rubber cover with a dial underneath it - turn that and hey presto the lights will come up :D

you should beable to feel it - it sits directly under the head light

hope this helps

stu

Hi Stu,
Thanks for your reply. I assume that there is one of these dials for each headlight assembly.  I can find it on the offside headlight but not on the nearside unit (the one that is stuck). Perhaps it has broken off! On the nearside, I can only find the motor unit.  Unfortunately, the car is lowered and I can\'t see what I am doing, even with a mirror. I work fairly close to one of the RX specialists and I will try and pay them a visit on Monday afternoon. At least they will have a means of seeing what\'s going on. In the meantime, thank you once again for your help - much appreciated.:Thumbsup!

regards,

Kerry

yeah there is one under each side

they should be covered by a rubber bung - you have to remove this to get to the dial

maybe it fell off one side - but still on the other ??

Stu

Kerry,

 Just a quick one (dont take offence if this was already obvious to you!) dont try to raise the headlamps anymore until you have the problem sorted, you run the risk of damaging the motor.

 :wave

its been a while since i posted on here ... so here is the update

well the switches arrived from Aus cost me £45 in total

opened the box , very well packed and looked in very good condition

i bought them as JDM switches - i was praying that i wasnt ripped off

out to the cab , switches fitted ( there is no dash in at the mo due the probs ) - plugged them in

fingers and toes crossed at this point

and woooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhooooooooooooooo work just perfect :D :D

you flash main beam - the lights come up and flash for aslong as you hold them on , let go and they go down

so thats another thing sorted - what gets me - where did the original switch go ??? thats the only thing i cant figure out ?

anyways - the lights work just fine now :D :D :D :D

just need to rebuild the dash , wire the alarm back in ( or completly remove - not sure yet ) - stick the back boxes on and its MOT time :D

im dead pleased - and this is proof that you cant use UK spec switches in a JDM car !!

Stu

Well done mate :D

bloody hell - that was a quick answer - are you stalking me

yeah im pretty pleased to be honest - just another step closer to getting this car running ( and probably sold :( )

i think the alarm will cause probs but my mate is convinced that he can put it back in - time will tell on this one !!

Stu

I know this is an old thread but I thought I\'d just mention that I\'m about to start hunting my own TII light gremlins.

Lights pop up on ignition.
Turn them on with engine running and they\'re stuck on main beam and main beam switch doesn\'t do anything.
With engine off main beam switch works.

I like the sound of a couple of earth points behind the bumper, but failing that I guess I\'ll try everything in here and maybe re-insulate the loom across the front...

cheers,
dod

its not that old :D

if the light pop up with the ignition on - thats a worry to start with

first thing i would do here

1 - pop up the bonnet
2 - remove the headlight fuse
3 - start the car

now see what happens - if the lights stay down then thats a start

if they come up - you have some issues as the lights are now getting their own power - and not how they should

try this and report back :D

Stu

hey.

just saw your post.

Never thought of testing with the fuse...

I stripped the loom across the front of the car (suggestion from Rotechniks after it went in for a TPS...)  LOADS of water from the left hand side of the loom.  Still no joy, so I\'m pretty sure the lights will do their thing without a fuse.  Will check that when I get back to the car from Dublin tomorrow night :>

I\'m thinking worst case scenario I just unhook the lights and wire in some dodgy cables for MOT.

I had a go at the switchgear too, only to be disappointed by a completely wrecked dash cowl.  What were they thinking!!? Those screw holes look like something off a chinese toy :/

Oh, and a bit of bad rust on the power steering cooler.

ho hum

let me know what happens with no fuse

we can then sort out the wiring - its not a big job ( he says !! )

Did you get another switch then Stu ?  :)

Think i`ll start off at 1500 for me FC stu :(   dont wanna sell it, but Boo hoo :( :(

Mick

see what happens mick

and yeah i got mine sorted out - had to import some switches from Aus off a JDM car - so they have done a bit of travelling

did a temp fit and they work exactly as they should :D

You know Stu, i been driving me rx about, and you see all these other verts, and i still think mine looks the best :) :) :)

and with it being de-badged , peeps aint a clue what it is   lol

Mick

ha ha ha ha :D

i know what you mean - i hated parted company with mine ( the EGI ) and the hunt started for a new one about 10 mins after the owner drove off in it !!

as you said - you have a good cause for selling yours - shame though - but needs must and all that

Had another quick go at this on Sunday.

Some obvious discoveries:
Headlights don\'t function with main headlight fuse removed.
Couldn\'t really do much with the interior fuse box as the lid\'s missing and my laptop was in the middle of a rebuild so I hadn\'t a clue what was what.

Also - wherever the fault is it\'s before the relays - no lights with either dimmer relay or headlight relay removed.

I  unbolted all relays and the fuse box in the engine bay, then removed the battery tray - just gonna try to get at all of the loom to look for corrosion.

Since everything works fine with ignition off I reckon the switches are okay.

Everything was fine when my dad got the car, then after a bump the fault appeared.  Once when I was driving it I went over a small bump and the lights went down for a second then back up.

right then - so it looks like the fuse is working as it should be :D

always helps

not sure what my next step would be - stripping the loom back is a big job - i would start checking wires for 12v - and then find out if they should or not !!

silly thought - you dont have the maintenance switch on do you ??

the one about the headlight switch ??

this would cause the lights to come up ( but then they would stay up all the time )

Hey

(I\'m back in Belfast now and not on-site with customers so have a little more time to post on here...)

Update:

Auto spark found that if he chopped a wire on the relay nearest the off side light, then the lights DON\'T pop up with the ignition i.e. the up down switch works as expected.  Maybe I should test all of the relays...

However he didn\'t crack the main beam thing so it wouldn\'t pass MOT.  Which didn\'t matter since the alternator belt busted off on the way there, taking the air pump belt with it LOL so I didn\'t make it.

I was gonna fess up and tell them about the lights just to complete the test and see what else would need done.  The reflectors are corroded anyway.

Anyone know if these (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/86-91-MAZDA-RX7-RX-7-EURO-CLEAR-XENON-HEADLIGHTS-HID-89_W0QQitemZ120126911398QQihZ002QQcategoryZ33710QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) would have the correct beam pattern for MOT?

OEM jobs are £83 each...

I used those on my old TII without any problems :)

Cool - did they pass the light beam tests on a machine then?

MOT2 here in NI is quite strict.  We book a test at a DVLNI center and they do most of the test themselves while you sit chewing your fingers off.

My MOT tester didnt even comment, but if the NI test is stricter there may be a problem...

I failed MOT with those style lenses - they have no clear beam pattern.
 
You need a lens that will cast a downward light pattern for UK and I think NI as well.  Check www.motuk.co.uk/manual/contents.htm (http://www.motuk.co.uk/manual/contents.htm) - tells you what you need to know.

good call.

Thanks for that - saved me wasting time ordering them and waiting etc.

I\'m gonna have to wait for Mazda then I think.

Anyone got a better idea than ordering from Mazda?

cheers,
dod

Order them from Jimmy\'s - i did a few years back, I brought good 2nd hand units, but I cant recall how much I paid.

good idea - they don\'t have any...
hmmm.
Might just order them from Mazda - if the car fails miserably look out for some brand new light units for sale on here :/

ask adam hawker ( hawker182 ) he is breaking a EGI - he might have the lights still - or have a look on ebay

just out of interest - another thing to check with the light - what happens if you take the switch out of the dash ??

you can then apply power to each contact in the block and it will make the lights do certain things ( on , off , pop up , pop down etc.. )

Stu

I guess you use a paper clip to join a +ve pin to the others?

I have the diagrams so I\'ll try that tonight.

Confirmed that the auto electrician I left it with has done something to stop the lights bypassing the up/down switch with ignition on.  I can drive with them down now, and not look like a tool, which is good.  He cut a wire to the relay furthest to the right looking into the engine bay.

But the main beam thing is still a factor.

Pop them up and they\'re off.
Switch the light switch round once and nothing seems to happen - will check tonight if that\'s just side lights.
Then another switch round and main beam city all the way.

will report back tomorrow on this with more ugly details.

best thing i bought for this was a "power probe" off ebay

cost me about £30 and its worth its weight in gold

you connect it to the battery and then you are left with a probe

on the probe there is a switch to apply 12v

so you stick the probe in the contacts - click the switch to shoot 12v down it and see what happens

im not sure what relay does what to be honest - but i managed to figure all mine out

i cant think what relays there are down there

1 - lights motor relay
2 - front fog relay
3 - air con relay
4 - side/dipped relay
5 - main beam relay

but dont quote me on that

there should be one with about 5 contacts - that does a lot of the switching

im not sure why they come up and down with the ignition - when that happens - are the lights on - or do they just pop up ?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SEALEY-PP1-Auto-Car-Power-Probe-6-24V-Brand-NEW_W0QQitemZ190119844425QQihZ009QQcategoryZ30921QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

crickey - they have come down in price - thats a billy bargain

Just bought one :>
"Congratulations, the item is yours. Please pay now"

The lights went wrong all at once when the car went over a bump.

Driving along and they popped up on Main Beam, but all went back to normal with the ignition off.

Now they don\'t pop up with the ignition but when they are turned on they\'re stuck on main beam, unless the ignition is off, in which case all is fine.

I thought it was all the same problem since it happened all at once, but now it seems to be two different things.

Although who knows what wire that auto spark cut.

he was trying to help me get through MOT by blagging the light test with the engine off. lol.

Sh!t I need that power probe tonight - should have just bought one in the shops.  Well it\'ll be handy for a spare in case the other one I buy tonight develops an electrical fault :/

Just an update for you on this, it\'s ok if the lights don\'t pop up / down - you can remove the retractor fuse, and wind the lights up manually, as long as the lights themselves operate from the switch it will pass MOT.

stuck on main beam - im sure thats a different relay

not sure what the sparky cut - it could be any number of wires

im just trying to work out a logical process for working out what went fault

i know for a fact that when i cut one of my wires - i couldnt get full beam to that is piggy backed onto the other relays

i wonder if you have some how jammed the relay open - hence it being stuck on full beam

what i would do i remove the relays from the front of the car - and then plug them back in one at a time and see what happens

right then - mine wouldnt pop up at all - i traced this to a bad 12v feed and added and extra feed

i ran this to a relay and another to the back of the switch loom - this sorted my probs out straight away

you need to find out if you are getting 12v at the switch then work from there

its the fact that they are stuck on is very stange - i would have thought that they would have been OFF all the time ???

I think that as you say main beam is the default then the dipper relay cuts into that.

This is the relay wire that was cut which stopped the ignition switch bypassing the up/down jobbie i.e. I can drive with lights down now (or up if I switch the up/down switch).

(http://www.idod.co.uk/images/relay_retractor_cut.jpg)

I can\'t find \'RG\' near the retractors in the Haynes wiring diagram, although I was wrecked last night and contemplating chucking the whole project in and getting a C36 Merc instead!

The Haynes is American so who knows what\'s different in there eh?

btw are those periodic white bands marked on the wiring diagram?
Like RG[W] for that cut wire up there?

PS I should have manually switched the compact camera to F7.1 to give that shot a bit more depth of field, but that\'s not really important here.

From memory - Red/Green wires carry 12V in the lighting circiuit - so they are connected to the big 30A lights fuse in the engine bay, or if it\'s the retractor relay then to the 30A retractor relay.  The ends should be taped or you will get shorts to ground :eek , but really they should not be cut as the lights won\'t operate correctly - unless you were going for that look ;)

yeh - they were taped up.

I just removed all tape to get photos of the colour coding ;)

I\'m gonna stop worrying about this until after Monday when the (2nd) auto spark sees it.

Just ordered the lights though...

This car could well end up as a track day car for someone else!

I mean why bother with all this hassle when Jimmy\'s has a black cab for 1500!?

Car is with Lisburn Auto Electrics, on recommendation.

No news yet but some encouragements:

- When I arrived there was a 360 Spider and a 540 BMW in the yard, the beemer getting work done.

- I tried to explain the symptoms and they weren\'t that bothered, preferring to get stuck in.

- They\'ve stripped the wiring apart to get at the problem.

Basically if they can\'t fix it, I\'m gonna sell it as is I reckon.

sounds like you have the right guys on the case at least :D

still no joy today - although Belfast was flooded today which took their electric out for half the day. Which is ironic.

Just had a go at FC3S forums - some people mentioned problems with Main Fuse.  Mine is pretty much corroded in, with broken plastic where someone\'s tried to remove it before.  

This could be relevant - I\'ll ask them to sort that out tomorrow...

i didnt think the main ( 80amp ) fuse did anything with the lights to be honest ??

Yeh but if it\'s corroded in who knows where that blue stuff has travelled to in the main fuse box...

Another day done and the owner of this Auto Electrics joint is getting pee\'ed off with it.

These guys are a professional outfit, wiring full kit cars etc.  I do believe they know what they\'re at.  If he doesn\'t find the problem tomorrow then he\'s gonna give up.

That will be the death knell (http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/k/k0088500.html) for the car I think! No MOT means it will have to be a track car or drift machine or something.

The motor is strong too (as in keep up with a Clio Sport strong). That\'s the whole point of this exercise.  Not sure what I\'ll do if it isn\'t fixed tomorrow.

I might ask them to string in some new wiring...

humm i cant think back how i tracked the probs with mine

it was a case of checking that stuff had 12v , checked that wires had continuety ( not broken ) then just went around checking that the relays clicked as they should and that the lights worked

then susses out that i wasnt getting 12v at the switch - once i had fixed that it pretty much sorted itself out :D

have you checked that the light switch isnt broken ??

Well the whole lighting system is a-okay with the ignition switch off so I think that means the switch is fine?

Update to the Saga is this: when I went back to get the car last Thursday it wouldn\'t start, as in wouldn\'t even fire once.

They were holding the ignition on for about 30secs at a time with not one fire.  I left it with them to fix themselves.

It worked when I took it in now it doesn\'t so they\'ll have to work that one out I think.

ekkkkkkkkk thats not good at all

sounds like they have flooded it thats all

and you should never crank for more than 15 secs at a time - it will kill the starter motor eventually

okay car is running again. "a wee bad connection" is all it was.

looks like I\'m just going to have to figure it out myself then.

Gonna start with the dodgy main fuse and see what shape that main fuse block is in. Then start tracing everything from the switch down.  Since the lights are faulty only with the ignition switch on, I guess the problem could be anywhere from the switch down.

The Haynes wiring diagram is the best I have I think, but I\'m still trying to get more!

i have some diagrams at work i think

its just strange that you get the light on with the ignition on ??

first thing i would do is

1 - remove the headlight switch

and then see what happens :D

you can then look at the all the connectors and i can tell you what most of them do

then we can work from there

if the lights stop playing around with the switch out - it could just be a knackered switch

2nd the switch idea,  dodgy terminal touching inside, would cause this,

what car u got ,  got a wiring diagram for a rx7

Mick

question - are the lights supposed to work regardless of the ignition switch?
That\'s what I have - fully functional main/dip beam with up/down as well.

Then with the ignition switch the light switch works as in turns lights on and off, but somehow the dip beam relay is totally out of the equation.

i.e. for example:
Get into car.
Pop lights up then down.
Turn lights on to side then dipped beam.
Flip the main beam jobbie.
Then back again.

Everything to this point works 100%
Lights are up and on dipped beam.

turn ignition switch to IG

AAAAAAGH F*** S*** B**** Q*** (I made that last one up)

Lights are now on main beam.
Main beam indicator is on.
Dip/Main flipper does nothing.

I didn\'t think there was any ignition 12v to the light switch, since they work 100% with the key out.

btw what\'s "Latch CCT" in the wiring diagram to the dipped beam relay?

oh and it\'s an \'89 Turbo II in faded red, with a strong engine and leaky clutch hydraulics.

right then - the clutch is an easy fix - dont worry too much about that

the lights very strange

they shouldnt work without the key to IG - so you have something wrong somewhere

first thing - remove the switch - then let us know what happens :D

there should be 12v at the back of the switch - but only with the key in IG ( i think )

if you have a dodgy switch then this could cause lots of probs

there is a white block connector what the switch plugs into - i can tell you what most of the contacts do inside this ( its all wrote down at home )

to be honest - the switch controls everything - so it does sound like a dodgy switch :D

Stu

know what I\'m beginning to think I should check the switch :o

So they definitely shouldn\'t work with key out!?  That\'s good news in a perverse way.  I also discovered that the main fuse is not in fact corroded in, but is held in by two screws by design :/ Since the fuse was broken I assumed that someone else had discovered it was corroded in; seems that they weren\'t as bright after all.

The whole dash area has to be the weakest point of these cars eh? Those plastic posts in behind holding EVERYTHING on are like something out of a chinese toy no?

Hey do you think it\'s wise to with-hold full membership fee until I get this fixed? If I don\'t ever fix it the regular rotary magazines would do my head in! lol

There\'s no reference to the ignition switch in any of the headlight wiring diagrams I\'ve seen?

hummmm i know what you mean about the switch on the wiring diagrams

i have to admit im not 100% sure what they do if you operate the lights with NO key in the ignition

im sure they dont work though - although i could be wrong ( and usually are )

the switch is the key i think - and its only a 10 min job to remove

take off the cowl - leave all the switches in place and just unplug them

pity you arent a lot closer - i could have bobbed down and tried a few switches

there is an easier way to check

stick your head under the dash - and there will be a loom that comes from the light side - follow this to the footwell and it plugs into another loom - you could always unplug it at this point :D

well all I mean is that starting and charging diagram for example usually has the ignition switch on there, particularly for the ST position, but just importantly for the ignition itself...

But the headlight circuit diagrams don\'t seem to have the switch on there.

Also my 93 Honda Accord lights do the full range with no key in...

I\'ll try the switch tonight.  I\'ll have to mess around with a bit of wire though, because with ignition on the switch does turn the lights completely off.

hummm start with the cheapest which is the switch

lets get that out of the equation first :D

Maybe the wiring diagram just shows a line with 15 on it,  That will be the ignition,

Major Update for you guys:

I took the switch out and tested the plug with one of those automotive testers (cracker tool).

The Haynes didn\'t really match the plug pins but I worked out the main ones anyway.  Got headlights on and the fault was still there - everything fine with no ignition then turn that on and no dipped beam.

Interesting point is that with ignition on and lights off I could use the main beam flipper to flash main beam - when I did this the head light pin in the plug would reverse polarity...

Anyway - I played around with side lights and the light motors then tried the head lights one last time.

And it worked!

Difference was that the side lights stopped working.  I may have blown a fuse to that (and the dash light, and possibly the head light washers) and that\'s made all the difference.

Full Main-Beam/Dipped-Beam functionality has been restored, and as it sits I can surely wire the side lights in myself for the mean time.

Happy Days :Thumbsup!

you might have blown the side light fuse - i did that loads of times when testing mine :D

glad you like the testing tool ( is that the ebay one i told you about )

my prob was that i was only getting 9.5v at the switch and that wasnt enough to power the lights at all - so i had to rewire that in from the fuse ( keeps it need and if the fuse blows it nice and safe )

it worrying that you have fixed it and 2 sparkies couldnt ???

have a look in the fuse box there is an ILLUM fuse that does the dash lights - i keep blowing mine for some strange reason

cant figure out why the pin swapped polarity though ?

you can use the tester though to power the side light feed from the switch to confirm if you have a blown fuse or not :D

Stu

Yes that wee Sealey job is great.
Did I tell you I got two of those in the post? For the price of one :>

I think if that thing helped me fix the lights I\'m gonna hang the unopened one on the wall!

Good to hear that it\'s easy to blow fuses. Makes sense in a way: that tool probably just fires a full 12v to the probe.

Yeh I already tested the side light feed with the probe and they are definitely out.

If I have to I might wire in the side lights with my own fuse or something.  (Just realised I can\'t do it straight from the battery - \'Volvo style\' at least runs off the ignition switch DOH).

you got 2 of them - blimey - thats impressive !!

get the fuse changed and work from there !!

and i think the prob just fires 12v as you said - be careful though - i managed to fry the headlight switch with one in about .5 seconds !

Right I had another bash at the car...

(I\'ve discovered that getting stuck into a few beers helps me get on with sorting my house out and occasionally working at the car too - otherwise I day dream too much :> )

Good news.
- Got an ignition switch; the car starts and runs fine.

Bad news.
- The headlights worked totally fine after I blew a fuse, which took out the side lights.  This also took out the indicators!! :mad:  I investigated the fuse box and two 15A fuses around the 30A power window fuse were blown.

They are ILLUM and TURN.

BOTH have to be good to get indicators and this then breaks the headlight circuit again.

So ditching sidelights to fix headlights won\'t work since this takes out indicators too (wouldn\'t get through MOT with no side lights anyway I guess).

The best diagrams I have are this stuff:
http://www.idod.co.uk/images/FuelControlHarness.jpg

So maybe the fuse box is corroded?
Or it\'s just plain old corrosion in the loom somewhere :eek

any update on this ????

you can cheat with the probe thing - and just use it on the back of the relays - this will also run the lights for you

No update I\'m afraid - busy sorting out my house (last year it was like Steptoe and Son, this year it\'s more like a Tate Modern Exhibit...), sorting the Legend out for MOT and, eh, playing Halo 3...

I also have an Accord waiting for my girlfriend\'s 21st* which has a duff battery and needs a bit of a seeing to.

The Legend needs a drop link and guess what the busted one is rusted in after 9 years service.

* We were both in our twenties until July 29th :eek

Not fussed on that ten minute limit on editing messages.
Actually makes me less keen on posting anything at all here in a way.
Surely the content is my intellectual property?

ANYWAY...
In case anyone\'s tempted to quip that my girlfriend is young to have a flat battery she\'s "All Electric"*; it\'s the car that has a flat battery :p

*http://www.powells.com/biblio?show=0767908406&page=excerpt

QuoteActually makes me less keen on posting anything at all here in a way.

its not very nice matey

Err :confused:

Quote from: doddyNot fussed on that ten minute limit on editing messages.
Actually makes me less keen on posting anything at all here in a way.
Surely the content is my intellectual property?

 Any posts are considered to be in the public domain.  The ten minute limit was instigated to stop people posting inflamatory comments when drunk/raging and then changing them to cover their own stupidity.
 
 If you want anything modified after the 10min limit feel free to get in contact with a member of the moderation team.

Okay I like the drunk thing good idea.

Anyway why the friar am I going OT on my own headlight fix thread!!?

Update is this:
I\'m not exactly full time on this problem more like half an hour a week if I\'m lucky.  I had a look yesterday and it\'s getting simpler:

Ignition on: headlights stuck on main beam.
15A indicator fuse out: everything\'s fine.
I finally worked out the wiring diagrams so I\'m looking for wires touching between turn signal circuit and headlight circuit.  The problem is constant i.e. nothing to do with wires which are switched on and off by the indicator switch.  The problem conceivably could be in the CPU since the diagram says that\'s where the indicator relay is?

One more thing - I have a pile of RX7 downloads here including the manual, photos of manuals and photos of manuals for other cars etc.

What\'s the closest thing any of you have to a bona fide Mazda wiring diagram for an 89 TII?

I think I can do it folks.  The car starts first time everytime what a shame to not let it rip!

i have this wiring diagram at home mate (well im pretty sure i do!). ill post up tonight either way.

Quote from: FD3SNuttahill post up tonight either way.

So if you have it you\'ll post it up and if you don\'t have it you\'ll post it up? :confused: :Giggle

Only messin mate. If I could get my hands on a proper wiring diagram I really think I can get this thing fixed.

One other solution is to put some thread on the indicator fuse and yank it out during the MOT light test :evillaugh

might be a long shot, but is your car a UK one?
 
If it\'s a TII - the shape of the rear lights and the length of number plate will help tell you - long number plate - UK - round rear lights - Series 5
 
If you have a UK/Euro car, then it will have the dip/dim relay in the lights circuit - I think this is fed from the 15A indicator fuse, and has wires that connect to the headlights and retractor as well as the ingition - so if it\'s going straight to on, then the dip/dim control relay may be spooned.
 
You can locate it up behind the glove box - mine was grey about 2"x2"x1" in size - it as 6 connectors going to it  (Earth, sidelights, Main Beam, 15A Feed, Retractor Relay, Dip Beam) - a short here would give the symptoms you describe possibly ?
 
If you unplug the relay, the light circuit behaves the same as a US model.

Good good I like this info!

Long plate check round lights check.

I think the relay itself is fine because the whole thing works okay with ignition off or with that 15A \'turn\' fuse out.  (Are you sure that the dim/dip relay is fed from that fuse? Maybe my fuse box diagram is wrong...)  The Haynes only has wiring schematics which aren\'t much use if you don\'t know where the components actually are!

If that is indeed where the relay is then I think you\'re on to something.  And I may indeed be able to sort it out tonight! How cool would that be?!  (I would then have the pleasure of moving onto the squidgy spongey alledgely \'brake\' pedal...)

Tell you what there are some relays and wires hanging out near the glove box.  I also found that three wires from the main light cluster switch have been cut and re-connected...  This car has had a hard life.

Although as I\'ve maybe said 0-60 in 6.75s (Trax) with 135K on the clock surely suggests rebuild?

Relay hanging out on the end of a long wire sounds familiar - that\'s how I found mine ;)
 
This relay is not in the Haynes guide, on the UK models, there was also an extra 2 relays at the front for the Headlights (guess what - these aren\'t in the haynes guide either) - one is for the retractor circuit and the other is for the dip/dim resistor.  Basically the box behind the glove box is supposed to put the headlights on when the sidelights are on and the ignition switch on, but through a resistor so they come on dim.  If you switch to headlights position, then the circuit is disabled and the normal 12v is fed to the headlights.  The Full beam should always work, but does not operate the retractors on UK models - so if you flash someone with the lights off, you get full beam through the Flash To Pass lenses.
 
The circuit inside the relay behind the glove box has a transistor, some resistors and diodes and a small relay.  It senses the signal from the sidelights, and the dipped/main beam, turning the relay on when the sidelights are on, and off when dipped/main beam are on.  The relay gets it\'s power from the 15A fuse - not sure if it\'s indicators or sidelights/tail lights fuse, but the circuit only has power when the ignition is on.  The relay contacts drive the 2 extra relays at the front - one of them is just wired into the retractor circuit - so it pops the lights up when selected, the other one wires a resistor in series with the lights to a 12V feed - so the main lights come on dim.  The resistor hides under the air filter on the left hand side at the front - if you have an after market cone you will see it ;) - long flat rectangular heat sink thing with a pair of wires going into a little 2 pin plug.
 
When you select the main headlights position (dipped or full beam), the whole circuit is effectively bypassed, so the lights should behave as they would normally.

This is a revelation my friend! An epiphany even...

So you think I can bypass all this glove box stuff and get standard headlights to work without flash to pass or headlights on dim?  Maybe I need the dim headlights for regulation sidelights... or are these dimmed headlights just in addition to the sidelights beside indicators?

Perhaps someone has tinkered with this for a bit of cool factor with the pop ups...

i have found the relevent diagram. but its like 5mb long. You got an email addy? i will email you the whole thing. if you was a member id be able to send it!!!!

In fact just so you know i have the whole workshop manual for an S4 and the S5.

Naz - hello chap - you got the UK one (S5) as a PDF ?
 
If so I\'d love a copy - gotta be worth a Beer or Coffee ! :cheers

Prof that relay was exactly the problem.

If I had noticed that the headlights popped up dim with just ignition i.e. light switch on OFF position, then you would probably have thought of that one before now...

Cool!! So chuffed.

Now for the drive belts and leaky clutch.
Someone told me that I need proper Mazda belts i.e. that\'s why it keeps throwing Halfords belts off.

FD3SNuttah cheers!  If this thing passes MOT I will certainly become a member...

My add. is a \'d0t\' dodridge \'at\' kainos \'d0t\' com

Mine\'s 89 TII is that S5?

thanks all...

Doddy - does yours have the round style rear lights, and colour coded bump strips?   Im sure you will have an S5.

Dont worry i have the diagram for that too actually. ill get home tonight and find somewhere on the web which i can upload it to. i will post a link and then you can download from there.

yeh S5 round rear lights.
Not sure about bump strips although the plastic moulding at the front used to be red LOL

ok give me till later then lads and ill bang em up on the net somewhere.

final post from me on this one:

I got brand new Cibies from Mazda (for a ton each :< ) and put them in two nights ago.

Driving last night to and from MOT center and the lights are indeed rubbish!
Mine aren\'t aligned properly yet, but still!

HID\'s truly transform the stock lights, but you may become unpopular with other motorists.
 
Ironically it\'s the chelsea tractor set with their \'high up\' lights and HID\'s who tend to flash me most :rollin