Mazda Rotary Club

General => General Technical => Anything Engine/Performance/Tuning related => Topic started by: Roy on November 16, 2006, 06:42:30 PM

Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 16, 2006, 06:42:30 PM
ive just picked up my rx7 and ive fallen uppon my 1st problem overnight

when i go to start the car the car will crank but will not turnover, a connection on the fuel pump was loose but once resolved it still wont turnover.

has anyone got any clues or ideas,

regards roy
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Jit on November 16, 2006, 07:19:25 PM
you mean itll crank but not start?
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 16, 2006, 10:23:23 PM
yes mate, it whurrs like a drill but wont actually turnover
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 16, 2006, 11:47:29 PM
Starter is ether stuck, Shot or loose. Another possablity is the battery well charged up??

Try Checking the Bolts holding it are tight (whilst your there make sure there isn\'t a gap between the Box and the engine (comon on T2\'s not sure about FD\'s)

if this don\'t fix it you may want to look at getting a new starter.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 16, 2006, 11:48:48 PM
Panic if it is turning the Motor but it still sounds like an Electric drill (turning over very quick) ;)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 16, 2006, 11:51:06 PM
reading through the forum, it looks like ive flooded the engine. im going to get some jump leads and leave the car for 24hrs to see if i can start it again !
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 17, 2006, 08:01:14 AM
In that case your best off Removing the EGi and the Plugs, turn it over until there is no white vapour coming out the Plug holes then tow it round the Block and Bump start it.

If its just flooded it will start that way (thats if its a manual)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Martiny on November 17, 2006, 02:05:28 PM
Turn it over with the accelerator floored, it might start. Also, find the little rubber pipe for the boost gauge, and put some oil in there with a syringe. Saves taking the plugs out (maybe).
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 17, 2006, 06:29:31 PM
TBH i know its personal preference and all but i don\'t like adding oil, i think it is just some thing else to foul the Plugs.

I have started pulling the BOV out (engine side) and spraying Easy start in which i find helps once you have done the Flooded Sequence (take plugs out and EGI fuse and Spin over etc etc) You can still start it with the BOV out but once it starts put it back in.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 18, 2006, 08:23:52 AM
Thanks all, and thanks to the information i found on the forum about flooding etc, we towed the car around the block with it in second gear, it started up & burnt all the wasted fuel off, it now starts perfectly and runs fine again

off to pickup my spark plugs today as i will not drive the car untill they are swapped

heres a pic of the exhaust 10mins after we got rid of the fuel !! luckily its booked in for a turbo back today !

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b112/roy_barber99/DSC00625.jpg
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 18, 2006, 11:01:02 AM
Sounds Good. Just remember these things tell you when you miss treat them ;) they like to be warmed up if you start them at all from Cold and serviced quite regularly.

If not they do things like Flood or start to act like the Motors going (so it S**t\'s you up :yes) but if you treat it with Respect it will put a BIG grin on your Face.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Martiny on November 18, 2006, 01:38:42 PM
if its not warmed up and you want to switch off, then...

Hold revs at about 3 k.
Now turn off and floor it at the same time.
Keep pedal floored until it stops.

This will dry out the chambers as it spins down.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 18, 2006, 01:42:33 PM
I\'ve not heard that before thats a cool trick.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 18, 2006, 06:10:07 PM
thanks guys, the car is running but is very very lumpy, runs fine out on a run but misses between 3&4k and very lumpy idle

any ideas?
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 18, 2006, 06:48:25 PM
Have you changed the Plugs etc yet? If so what did they look like?

Does it feel like its holding back or misses and Pops when you drive it? Any odd noises?

If it drives fine i don\'t imagen the engine has gone but it May be worth getting it Compression tested.

The fact it had flooded would tend to mean there is a fairly ovious fault, maybe a Vac pipe off, leaking Primary Injector or a Coil pack going down?? Thats why looking at the plugs to see if one set is not firing properly will help.

When you say rough, do you mean it hunts or idles higher or lower??? The miss, is that under load or all the time?
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 12:15:26 AM
hi thanks again for the reply !

ive ordered new plugs from sumo performance. in the mean time when we removed the plugs we cleaned with carb cleaner as per the guide on the forum, they went back in and worked fine

although they were very black when the were taken out

the miss is like a judder amd the exhause spitts flames, and sounds like a machine gun ! and feels like its holding back

the engine was rebuilt 500 miles ago

it idles higher and lower, sounds as if its about to stall but doesnt, then some times it will stall
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 01:31:34 AM
I sugest you ring the engine builder and explain whats happening, it may be the case they will sort it out as part of the Warantee?? worth a try.

Just one to check, there is a Little black box with a Vac pipe coming off it bolted to the Bulk head nr the Throttles, This is the Map sensor, Have a good look at the pipe for any splits or damage (maybe a good idea to take it off put your fingure over the end and blow down it to see if there are any leaks, also check its not blocked as it has a little filter in the line), take the Electrical plug off and on a few times to clean the Conections. If all is good put it back together.

Just a word of warning though, Be carfull when removing the Vac pipe from the Map Sensor. (its only Plastic and they brake quite easy, I usaly cut the pipe off nd replace it anyway to be on the safe side but you knever know it may be loose)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 11:07:53 AM
thanks grizzly, i will give that a try as well, if you could get me a picture of what you mean that would be a great help.

aparantly when the loss of power first occured, my freind heard a pop, then the loss of power. could the pop have been a bust pipe whilst acelerating ?
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 12:46:31 PM
Its possable, What sort of a Pop was it? Pop like a Miss fire or pop like pressure being let off?

if its loud enough to here inside the car it maybe a Boost pipe or something that holds Pressure?? But i know that an Fd will run without the IC pipes on quite well (smoothly at idle) It may have blown a gasket between the inlet manifold? (if you blow a gasket in the inlet betwen the Throttles and Engine it does odd things to the idle and makes it run rough? but you often here like an Exhaust Blow from the Turbo area too)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 12:57:21 PM
Just found this pic of where the Map sensor lives. (I hope the owner don\'t mind me putting it up in here :))
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 02:46:33 PM
thanks for the pic, the pop did sound like pressure being let off ... i thought id poped a turbo ! lol

you can smell fuel in the engine bay area, but that might be because of the flood
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 05:47:04 PM
just to help mate, ive just seen this vid and its exactly like mine ... to the T

http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...video-0026.flv
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 06:14:59 PM
Quote from: Royyou can smell fuel in the engine bay area, but that might be because of the flood
Where abouts does it smell most? do you see any Liquid fuel about? I know when they flood they do tend to have lots of fuel about but if you get it running and up to temp etc the smell should go?

I\'m guessing the smell is strongest around the Inlet? it could be that its not running well so its overfueling but I don\'t like Rx7 Fuel leaks (the Fuel rail is right above the Turbo\'s)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 06:49:53 PM
right near the spark plugs, might be because of me spitting the fuel out when i was turning it over with no plugs in.

just want to sort it, ive only driven it once :(
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 07:10:40 PM
Ahh ok. Lots of fuel came out then :)
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 07:11:11 PM
Quote from: Royjust to help mate, ive just seen this vid and its exactly like mine ... to the T

http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h3...video-0026.flv
BTW your Link aint working.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 07:11:45 PM
yea .. it was flooded.

it starts fine, just the lumpyness and it wanting to stall
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 07:17:27 PM
sorry try this


http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h319/jamie_eaton/misc%20vids/?action=view¤t=video-0026.flv
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 07:17:37 PM
Did you have a Look at the map Sensor?
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 07:27:53 PM
I would say speak to your Engine Builder, There are so many things that would cause that you need to take it to some one that can see it first hand.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Grizzly on November 19, 2006, 08:32:33 PM
This may apply to you too.

http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=263866&page=3&pp=15&highlight=idle+white

I\'m just reading up becouse its some thing new to me too and every one seems to be sugesting Coolant Temp Sencer.
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 19, 2006, 11:20:15 PM
thanks dude, im off back to my mates unit tomoro to have a good look
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 20, 2006, 06:37:00 PM
THANK YOU !!!!

it was the boost pipe, it had fallen off ... its now running like a dream !!
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Tintin on November 27, 2006, 08:57:45 PM
Roy , if you need a helping hand ever just give us a shout I\'m only down in sheffield , if your new to FD\'s it can be a steep learning curve but if your good with your hands you\'ll pick it up in no time

make sure you enjoy it when she\'s running well coz it probably means she\'s gonna break down soon :D
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 27, 2006, 09:02:12 PM
thanks mate, you maybe needed ;)

ive just managed to spin it over 4 lanes of traffic and hit only a traffic cone !

just needs front bumper spraying !
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Tintin on November 27, 2006, 09:13:36 PM
the learning curve aint just mechanical , IMO it don\'t matter how many performance cars you\'ve driven if you put your foot down at the wrong time the back will go ( been there myself :D )
Title: Crank but no turn
Post by: Roy on November 27, 2006, 09:15:12 PM
your right !!

was in a straight line doing 40mph !!!  and yep i did have to change my pants !

could have a mini meet when its back on the road, its having a lot of work done inside