Mazda Rotary Club

Cars by Model Type => 2nd generation RX-7's => Topic started by: grinder on July 30, 2006, 11:24:32 PM

Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on July 30, 2006, 11:24:32 PM
Hiya fellow FC owners :D

right then always had a handling issue with the FC - not a major prob but its time to see how to sort it

done the rear DTSS bushes and the back end seems fine now

all the other lower bushes on the back end were OK - no real play in them ( or not that we could see and they all looked solid and not falling apart )

so onto the front end now :)

are there any OBVIOUS ones to check ( i know the DTSS is a prime example on the back ) - so what about the front ??

when i back it off the drive - it always seems to clunk when the passenger wheels drops off the curb ( 1 inch tops ) and onto the road on full lock - does this indicate something ??

i was out in the rover at the weekend over the twisties and it seemed soooooo firm on the road - i want the FC like that

so any ideas where to start - or do you jack it up and just have a look ??

i have looked at some powerflex bush kit thingy and there are about 40 bushes in there - is there really that many in the front ??

surely some wear quicker than the rest ???

anyways - bed time for me - so you lot have a think and i will check back tomorrow night :D :D :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Brett on July 31, 2006, 08:02:49 AM
Clunking could be caused by a knackered shock, worn roll bar mount, the list is endless!
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on July 31, 2006, 08:14:47 AM
I had this said same clunk - turned out to be the control link arms - one was badly bent and the other broken.  They are only about 6 inches long - but these affect stability of the rear end.  They are used to prevent the wheels going out of alignment on the vertical plane (camber) when you go over a bump / pothole - which fits with the curb clunk symptoms.

Incidentally, I noticed the curb clunk first, then when driving in a straight line and hitting a hole on one side it would upset the handling more than I expected.

Might be worth checking these babies.

Cheers,

Prof :cheers
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on July 31, 2006, 08:52:23 AM
Prof - are these on the front or the rears ???
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on July 31, 2006, 09:42:23 AM
Rears - See the attached bitmap - it\'s item no 4.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: FD3SNuttah on July 31, 2006, 11:02:14 AM
end links are always weak on jap motors!

but id change the main bushings on your front arms to begin with and replace your shocks with newer items. i bet your still on the originals?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on July 31, 2006, 01:32:55 PM
should have said that its a front end clunck ! - or would this still make that noise

i have had a look on the FSM - and there are some of these on the front aswell - maybe i need to check them out

and yes Nas - still on the stock suspension components

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 06, 2006, 08:16:43 PM
Get a pry bar and gently lift all the Ball joints and see if there is any Movment, if there isn\'t grab hold of your Strut as high up as poss and force it about (your best forcing the strut rather then the spring as it works better) see if there is any movement in the Top mounts.

It may also be a good idea to get some one sat in the car holding the steering wheel (Well!!) and you grab hold of the Steering arm and push it in and out to see if there is any play in the rack.

Still no Joy buy a pair of Anti roll bushes and the 4 lower arm Bushes and replace them (Easy job compared to the Rear steer Bushes ;))
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 06, 2006, 08:19:53 PM
Knowing the front of a T2 if it Clunks when you are on flat ground (No bumps) its very likly to be the Lower Ball joint or Track rod end, if it Clunks when the suspension moves its more likely to be Drop link,Anti roll bush,Top mount Bad strut.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 06, 2006, 10:51:32 PM
cheers chris ( and long time no speak )

i will get reading what all that means and shall investigate further - once the weather improves :D :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 07, 2006, 12:59:10 AM
Yeh i think we\'ve had our two week summer :(
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 07, 2006, 08:53:28 AM
yeah i know what you mean matey !! LOL

i really would like to get the car sorted - but its knowing where to look !

like i said you mention the back and everyone says "oh yeah its the DTSS" but the front is a whole new ball game

thanks for the info though - will start pricing up parts ( ouch ! )

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: antnicuk on August 07, 2006, 10:48:37 AM
Stu
The front are really easy.   Once you have the hub off, its 2 bolts for the front shock, then 2 bolts hold the whole wish bone on,  once you get this off, the bushes are quit easy to fit.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 07, 2006, 01:59:18 PM
it always sounds easy when you write it down !! LOL

im thinking of getting a full set of bushes for it and do what i can

just need to find a "grinder" friendly price now :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on August 07, 2006, 03:01:48 PM
Stu,
 
If there is enough interest, then what about a \'group\' buy ?
 
I for one would be interested.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Kron on August 07, 2006, 04:04:00 PM
I\'ve noticed a master set of \'Energy Suspension\' polyeurophane bushes for the 89-91 can be had for around $100 (£52) before postage.

Is this too much?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 07, 2006, 05:08:22 PM
i have seen them cheaper - about $78 i think

i outbid you on the ones on ebay - but it was reserve not met and he has listed them again - he wants £100 for them - i can buy them cheaper than that

i tried a group buy a while back - but the guy wasnt interested

i have a link somewhere to them - if you search for BUSHES in the 2nd gen section - you will find a link to them

ta

stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 07, 2006, 05:13:22 PM
http://www.nopionline.com/nopistore/dsp_parts.cfm?vpcid=410&vcatid=0010&vcatyear=1990&vmodelid=170&vmakeid=220&vL1id=0&&vtitle=MAZDA%20RX7%201990

these are the ones im looking at - when i last looked in dec 2004 they were only $63.10

and he quoted $30 shipping with a 6-10 day turn around

i might drop them an email to see new shipping costs - dont seem a bad price though to be honest :D :D :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on August 07, 2006, 05:40:46 PM
Chassis bush kit - which ones is that - just the frame / suspension bushes or the others as well ?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 08, 2006, 11:15:52 AM
dont ask me matey - i have no idea - i think thats the full kit ??

unless someone can shed some more light on this

i have a pdf somewhere of what they come with ... runs off to check !!

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 08, 2006, 11:22:46 AM
i think these are them ..........
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Loxam on August 08, 2006, 11:46:11 AM
(http://129.33.208.36/LProthane42002Bushings.jpg)

Says complete car, looks like a lot too :)

Id be interested in a group buy on them :)
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on August 08, 2006, 01:13:57 PM
Me too - that\'s a lot of nice red bits there, that is !
 
Just need to book half a year off to fit them all :(
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Kron on August 08, 2006, 01:33:26 PM
Count me in for a group buy as well please.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 08, 2006, 01:42:27 PM
errrrr the guy wont do a group buy - unless i can find someone else to get them from ???

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on August 08, 2006, 02:59:04 PM
What about a bulk order to save on postage though ?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Loxam on August 08, 2006, 04:06:34 PM
Yes yes bulk order!
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 09, 2006, 01:01:30 PM
hummm that might attract a lot of customs interest ?? and then have to pay duty

im still trying to dig out my old emails from the guy - to see exactly what he said about them

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Kron on August 09, 2006, 01:57:08 PM
Corksport do a \'FULL\' kit for $109

http://corksport.com/store/category/4ltx/2rx-Suspension_misc.html

I\'ve bought a couple of items from them already and they are 100% reliable and very efficient with delivery and contact.

I was going to order a Mazdaspeed lip and R-Magic Radiator shroud soon so shall I see if they can do any discounts for a group buy?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 09, 2006, 08:47:54 PM
from reading that link - it looks the same as what i posted - if you look at the gif image it tells you what comes with the kit

im not 100% but it certainly looks the same

im still shocked that no one in the UK sells them ( or at this price ) - to be honest i was thinking of buying a set - then ebay it with a buy it now price - then buy another and so forth :D :D - sneaky but everyone else does it

i need to have a scout around and see who else does them and get a group buy sorted out - its just finding someone who will accept the group buy take payment and ship to individuals - now thats a challenge :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 12, 2006, 04:02:54 PM
Stu try this place //www.mmr-direct.com I\'ve just been told they do the whole T2 suspension bush set for $190 inc DTSS bushes etc.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 12, 2006, 06:08:31 PM
thanks chris - these prices seem to be going up not down !! LOL

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: antnicuk on August 12, 2006, 09:53:55 PM
i used the prothane kit,  some of the bushes didnt fit very well and i ended up getting some from Burtons and lathing down to fit.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 13, 2006, 01:04:25 AM
Yeh, I personaly used an Energy kit from Mazdatrix, they fit well but i don\'t exactly know what i payed for them as i bought lots of other stuff at the same time (Saving Shipping costs ;))

TBH if i was going to rebush a car i would seriously think about using OE bushes, mainly becouse for the advantage the Polly bushes give you it does\'nt make up for the fact the OE ones will last three times longer.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Kron on August 13, 2006, 09:23:49 AM
I thought the whole point of polyurathane ones were the enhanced durability?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 13, 2006, 12:28:10 PM
Nope, The hole point is to remove unwanted movement from the suspension when you Brake hard or at WOT. Racers arn\'t Worried about them lasting in terms of years rather in terms of Races.

Basicly so when you set your Geo up it stays in the same place under load. There for the car will Handle better and be more Predictable.

If you think about it the Harder the Bush the move Vibration that it will alow through the Car and also with it being harder they have less shape returning Propertys (Basicly when the suspension is hit hard the Rubber bush will allow a set amount of movement and will return to its orignal shape where the Polly Bush will move less without distorting, So if the Polly bush is put under on off load for long periods the bolt hole in the middle elongated and the nush may also become slack in the Mounting hole)

The reason that its good to change you bushes is becouse after 10 years the std Bush will start to crack and seperate causing exesive Suspension Movement which will act like the Car is steering its self under load. The main reason people use Polly bushes is the Price !! OE bushes arn\'t cheap.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 16, 2006, 07:14:55 PM
Did you get your Poly Bushes Stu ;)
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 16, 2006, 07:41:57 PM
nah not yet matey ... still not sure where to start - im now slowly getting convinced i have knackered shocks :(

im sure the car sits at slightly different heights at the front

i need some really level ground and a ruler :D

the bushes - there is no real rush to be honest :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 16, 2006, 08:04:01 PM
well if its not sat level it\'ll be your Springs, But that will make it drive funny.

TBH if your car is still one its first Stuts and springs it would not suprise me at all  they are a bit tired.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 16, 2006, 08:08:57 PM
yeah its all orig

i have a full set of lowering springs - i could try fitting them i suppose - it just looks a big job !!

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Grizzly on August 16, 2006, 08:17:23 PM
Not that big, Two bolts at the base of the Strut four at the to and its off, if you have some Spring compressors it\'ll take five minutes to swap the springs. While the springs off you can see how much resistance there is in the Struts.

TBH the rears are the worsed to do becouse you have to remove the Rear Speaker covers and speakers...   :Thumbs-up Its more time consuming than Hard , you\'d do them all in a day if you took your time.
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 16, 2006, 08:27:23 PM
ah right - i thought it would be a pain to do :)

its already insured with the lowering springs - just not fitted them :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: paul3944 on August 16, 2006, 09:01:34 PM
Hi All

I\'ve just finished fitting my energy suspension kit to the front and there is a difference in handling, while i was there i found a knackered ball joint, brake disc covers corroded, and just about every bolt frozen :mad:

The kit wont do all the rear there are lots of bushses missing (see pic), as mentioned Iam looking at MMR direct who also sell on ebay US :Typing

Paul
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: shaunwil on August 16, 2006, 10:37:15 PM
The red ones may not be be bushes, if its like the 3rd gen they coupld be sperical bearings and usually you need to get mazda oem. Does it feel like a ball joint ?

Shaun
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 16, 2006, 10:52:11 PM
im convinced its now a front end prob - so the kit may do the job ???

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: Prof on August 16, 2006, 11:29:46 PM
Don\'t mean to hijack the thread, but slightly related...
 
Does anyone know what springs fit the convertible - it is heavier than the hard lid, and a lot of the aftermarket springs say \'Not for the convertible\' in the ads :(
 
Also did anyone find a supplier for the bushes kits ?
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: grinder on August 17, 2006, 10:17:44 AM
not found a supplier yet ( not that i have looked ) :(

i need to pull my finger out one night and have a good look round and see whats out there

i had a look at the ride height on mine and the passenger side sits 4mm higher than the drivers side on the front and back - i think my drive isnt level !! LOL

need to get into a big carpark and have a better look :D

Stu
Title: What bushes to check next
Post by: antnicuk on August 17, 2006, 10:25:06 AM
Quote from: shaunwilThe red ones may not be be bushes, if its like the 3rd gen they coupld be sperical bearings and usually you need to get mazda oem. Does it feel like a ball joint ?

Shaun


the red ones are the ones that come in the kit,  they are just 2 piece bushes with a metal core.  I didnt do the diff and subframe mounts on mine,  thats a much bigger job.   The ones at the end of the tie bars are ball joint type fittings,  you wont get theose in a kit.