Author Topic: Told you Rotary Power was cheap  (Read 293 times)

Offline clive

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Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« on: January 19, 2020, 07:28:57 PM »
Just seen this ad on Facebook, not saying the engines not worth it, just saying a Rotary gives you a hell of a lot of bang for your buck  :great:.

2.3 litre Jondel Vauxhall XE Rally Engine no power figure but I would say probably around 260 to 300 brake, for £8,995

I have heard of Ford Crossflow engines costing 25K and even one of the Civics I race at 14.5K

A 500bhp Rotary engine block is going to cost maybe 4K from a Rotary builder, like I said,  a hell of a lot of bang for your buck  :great:
« Last Edit: January 19, 2020, 07:31:04 PM by clive »
All the best Clive

Offline Jamie R

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2020, 07:56:08 PM »
I had a Vauxhall red top in my mk1 escort.

I changed the rod bolts to ARP ones, 4 branch exhaust manifold ( that's the key to unlock the power on these) and twin 45mm DCOE's

Was spitting out 192bhp with pretty much stock internals.

Its just Rotors and GRP
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Offline Jamie R

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2020, 08:04:00 PM »
I think the point I'm trying to make is, is an extra 80 bhp worth 8k ?

I suppose red tops have gone up in value in the past 15 years. They had cosworth heads.

So yeah, when you weigh it up, big hp numbers in a rotary are easily achievable for the same sort of budget 
Its just Rotors and GRP
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Offline re japi

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2020, 06:38:05 AM »
Exatly. Rallycross Duratec 2,2 16v costs about 8-10 k€. You need to get 6000€ forged crankshaft if you want to rev it. And after all that, you get around 280-290 horses. 13B PP with same costs give ya around 315 horses

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Power is nothing without control. Weight is enemy of performance, handling and braking.

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Offline boosted

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2020, 08:50:44 AM »
There is 1 4 pot that is bullet proof and being used in motorsport...
The honda k20... cheap and 200 bhp. Few relatively cheap intake upgrades. Manifold and TB 250bhp. Anymore power then big money K24 builds....but its  HEAVY. A Lotus with a k20 swap from a rover unit is 100kg heavier ive been told.
Its very much like a renny....9k rpm 200 bhp and vtec is similiar to the Renny ports...esp if mapped with lower vtec engagement. They can be boosted too on std internals...i follow Beytek on youtube who has a 500bhp in a k20 powered Fd !  Hes built in his garage...very impressive.

I think the k20 bucks the trend but yes Rotary is cheap power. As the K20 is being dropped in all sorts i expect the value of the engine to rise as they thin out.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing...we all wish we'd bought fd when they where 2500....
The REW is getting thin on the ground now.

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Offline re japi

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2020, 06:08:54 PM »
Actually, I agree and disagree with you Jon.

K20 is good for SOME power. However, if you want really good power for NA, K20 cant do it. It can go up to 270-280 range when made to the max. Its basically because of its head.

 If you want more, and like in our rallycross you do need more, only way is to go with F20 from S2000. It can go above 300. But there is there problem, that engine costs alot...

But yes, all those Honda engine are amazing. One of the best engines ever made. They can take s**t loads of beating and makes good power.

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Power is nothing without control. Weight is enemy of performance, handling and braking.

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2020, 06:16:00 PM »
Beyteks k20 is 520bhp turbod on std internals...i was amazed.
S2000 engine f20c is big and very heavy mind. I cant see why people tune zetec or the redtop anymore when the k20 is far superior...
But unlike rotary big money to rebuild and lots of "bits"!! Lol.

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Offline re japi

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2020, 04:16:15 AM »
Redtop, Zetec, Duratec, they are cheap and easy to get some power. But to get "enough" from them, thats a different story. But yes, K20 lump is better.

Funny thing is that there is engines that many have forgotten allready. Like Fiat /Lancia 2 litre engines are still quite good even tho they are old as heavens... :D

True, F20 lump is big. But thats best choise if getting max power out off NA lump.

How Honda engines can handle boost with stock internals, thats beyond my brain capacity :D
Power is nothing without control. Weight is enemy of performance, handling and braking.

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Offline Grant Monkhouse

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2020, 04:51:22 PM »
Rotary engines will give you decent hp for not a huge amount of money, however if you are wanting to squeeze every pony out of the motor just like those 4 pistons are then things can start adding up.

Engine rebuild kit with ceramic seals?
Balancing
Rotor lightening
Rotor clearancing
Rotor side scalloping
Intake porting
Exhaust Porting
Semi pp housings
Custom intake manifold
Custom slide throttle (not necessary but why not to squeeze every ounce of air flow and hp)
Engine dwelling and studding
Dry sump system for high rpm
Exhaust manifold

I rekon you would have well over 320hp with all that and the cost well over 10k?

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Offline re japi

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2020, 07:34:49 AM »
Dunno, but that amount that I have put money on my engine allready, Skyline lump would go upto 1000 horses, and mine wont give me even 500...  :13: :'(
Power is nothing without control. Weight is enemy of performance, handling and braking.

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Offline clive

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2020, 09:05:42 AM »
Dunno, but that amount that I have put money on my engine allready, Skyline lump would go upto 1000 horses, and mine wont give me even 500...  :13: :'(

Yes but it would cost, getting on for 20 years ago I knew a guy drag racing a Skyline ---------his big power engine cost 26K then and died in two events !

All the best Clive

Offline Grant Monkhouse

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2020, 09:36:38 AM »
Dunno, but that amount that I have put money on my engine allready, Skyline lump would go upto 1000 horses, and mine wont give me even 500...  :13: :'(
Iv been watching a YouTube channel, motive dvd I think where they go through making big power with RB engines and to get them to 1,000 hp you are looking a lot of work, and lots of dollars. They even go into depths of choosing the right block to start with by measuring the bore thickness and deck thickness, something a lot of the RB engines casting are poor especially when you compare them to a 2 JZ block, which essentially Toyota looked at the RB block and made improvements on the RB weaknesses

Which is why the 2J can pump out 2000 hp on a stock block

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Offline Grant Monkhouse

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Re: Told you Rotary Power was cheap
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2020, 09:54:09 AM »
Check out motive video on you tube

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