Author Topic: The other rotary Westfield!  (Read 21767 times)

Offline boosted

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #90 on: December 18, 2015, 05:22:43 AM »
How did you get on?
92 FD rx7 Twins 13.5psi.  EX Track car
EAT SLEEP ROTOR REPEAT.

Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #91 on: December 19, 2015, 11:45:39 AM »
Okay, time for an update on the test day at Llandow.  First of all I ran out of fuel before I ran out of talent so that must be good, leaving with empty fuel cans and everything else the same shape as it arrived is always the sign of a good days testing.

It was wet, not just a little but full on monsoon wet, even with full wets it was a lot of fun trying to keep it between the lines.

We started the day with a little scare, sighting lap, half way through the first warm up lap....  Oil Pressure alarm...  Engine off, towed off the circuit fearing the worse.  Turns out the sensor interface SSI-4 (0-5v to serial) was intermittent, rather than packing up with no pressure alarms we made the foolish decision to carry on for the day in the knowledge that if both the fuel and oil pressure were reading 0 it was likely a false positive!  We got lucky, not the recommended best practice approach guys!

Made loads of progress with the fuel map on the new engine during the day, a little more work to do at the top end (I'm also suspicious of a weak 044 pump but have no evidence due to the fuel pressure sensor problem) a we had some intermittent misfires over 8k but only in 3rd and more in 4th (4th is top for me as the diff ratio is all wrong!).  Need to check some logs on that over the weekend, the other possibility is that at high 90+ MPH there is some ram air effect into the intake causing the MAP to move to the 106kPa row and over fueling, will do some digging through logs.

The final drive ratio is still wrong (but we all already knew that!),  I'm going to order a 4.7 CWP set and rebuild the diff over the winter).

Cooling was good for the day, MAX 93C Water and 85C oil...  It was a cool day though and the amount of water going through the front of the car probably helped keep the temps down.  So for the time being I'm very happy that those changes have at least made a good amount of difference, will keep an eye on that as the ambient temp goes up and in dry conditions.

New engine seemed great, did not miss a beat all day (apart from the map work) so as a back of the garage ebay parts engine it has excelled in its new role!  So this gives us a working platform for events this season.

Jobs to do:
Re-work the loom (it has grown organically during the build and the sensor interface issue was the final straw, it need to be robust and simplified)
Swap out the 044 for a new one (it has taken some abuse over the various fuel problems and is a cheap test worse case I have a spare)
Swap out the non-return fuel valve (the car has never held pressure key off, I have not had any vapour lock problems but I would at least like to know why it does not do that)
Rebuild diff with 4.7 CWP
Swap the fuel pump switch for relay controlled from the ecu, one less thing to worry about and simplified the wiring (ask me how I know you don't want a fuel pump switch too close to the gear stick!)
Remove the dash box - now we have all the warnings, switches on the dash or automated from the ECU the box now only holds the master switch, ignition and start button.  They can have far shorter cable runs and be better placed on the PAX side of the transmission tunnel above the battery.  Again my new push to simplify everything!

So that's it...  I have no idea about lap times at Llandow but we were running in the 47 sec area in monsoon on full wets of the timed laps I was bashing out all the laps withing a couple of tenths so I was happy with the consistency.

We are planning another trip in Jan once we have got a few of the jobs done for some more testing and to test some of the fuel assumptions.
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline Casey

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #92 on: December 19, 2015, 02:40:21 PM »
It sounds like you had a successful day, not bad at all for a first outing  :)
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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #93 on: December 19, 2015, 02:50:56 PM »
Yep good result especially with a pulled so called duff engine ! 4.7 diff...nice. mucho acceleration.
92 FD rx7 Twins 13.5psi.  EX Track car
EAT SLEEP ROTOR REPEAT.

Offline clive

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #94 on: December 19, 2015, 07:42:23 PM »
Excellent news, few teething problems but going in the right direction.
All the best Clive

Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #95 on: December 19, 2015, 08:09:40 PM »
working out the sensor problem has opened up some more questions...

So the power feed to the SSI-4 was the problem, looks like just a loose spade at the fuse box.  But that same fuse also powers the APV (Aux Ports) motor controller, so it would seem that when the sensors failed so did the use of the AUX ports, which maybe explains the intermittent miss fire at high rpm as well.  I think I will still have a little look at the fuel pump but at least next time I will have got rid of another variable and will have fuel pressure logging back to diagnose the issue properly if it still exists.
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline clive

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #96 on: December 19, 2015, 09:33:55 PM »
On  the 440 Aux output 4 would normally be the output to operate the  SSV (secondary side valve) is this what you using ?

If not and your not sure of it working then it may may be an idea to fix this in the open position as a test because this would give the running out puff condition your describing.

Its also worth knowing that if you want the map looked over  then mail   tech@adaptronic.com.au  as I know they will be happy to help
 
All the best Clive

Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #97 on: December 20, 2015, 09:52:20 AM »
Yep that would be another candidate for suspicion for sure.  In this case it must be the AUX ports as I have to use and external DC motor controller (The 440 does not have any support for servo control) the motor controller I made is powered from the same source as the sensor interface so as one was not powered neither was the other which would mean no aux ports in operation.

Not to say it could not be both!

Hopefully a simple one this time!

Thanks Clive
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #98 on: January 10, 2016, 06:42:08 PM »
Small update folks... Had a fun day today making a PU foam passenger seat to hold some folks in to allow easy realtime tuning when testing etc.  You can make a great seat for about 40 notes and you get the fun of playing with expanding foam!
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #99 on: January 12, 2016, 07:17:36 PM »
Managed a few jobs tonight...

First a blue book requirement, fuel sample point.  This is an expensive dry break fuel tee to allow the nice scruitineers to take some of you fuel for testing...  Pointless for me, very useful for them!



Also stripped down the engine of much smoke...  The problem was knackered rotor oil seals... A hint to the issue...




Any guesses what made my shaft so hot... Ooo err missus?


Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline clive

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #100 on: January 12, 2016, 10:27:22 PM »
With Rotarys needing to gain much more cooling from the oil system than a piston engine, first question must be, what oil coolers are you running?
All the best Clive

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #101 on: January 12, 2016, 10:41:14 PM »
Also Clive think the Synionic oil would be a good idea to use.
92 FD rx7 Twins 13.5psi.  EX Track car
EAT SLEEP ROTOR REPEAT.

Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #102 on: January 12, 2016, 11:41:44 PM »
Problem was more fundamental, incorrectly installed thermal pellet replacement thingy...

Low flow through shaft leading lo the localised heating.

Lesson learned.

Using a 25 row setrab cooler ram air ducted...  Ts and Ps been good so far with that setup on the new engine.
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline Smiffers

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #103 on: January 12, 2016, 11:42:58 PM »
On a plus side I will have nice new rotary based  desk lamp soon!
Westfield SEiW - 13B-MSP BW 7670 Turbo
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Offline re japi

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Re: The other rotary Westfield!
« Reply #104 on: January 13, 2016, 05:59:34 AM »
Problem was more fundamental, incorrectly installed thermal pellet replacement thingy...

Low flow through shaft leading lo the localised heating.

Lesson learned.


How it was incorreclty installed?
Power is nothing without control. Weight is enemy of performance, handling and braking.

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